WJ Tie Rod Flip and Max Droop for Drag Link

[JohnBoulderCO]

Get your tie rod out of the rocks! One of the best mods you can do for your WJ if you wheel in the rocks.

The WJ's tie rod hangs very low and so does the steering stabilizer. I have broken 1 tie rod and bent one. I have destroyed 4 steering stabilizers, even after mounting them on top of the axle bracket (it's still low).

Adam (Jeepin' Wolf) was the first to do this modification on his WJ. You can see find his post on NAGCA. I have made some improvements to it.

You can flip your stock tie rod or buy a stronger one from Kevin (www.kevinsoffroad.com). Kevin's is thicker and doesn't neck down where the TRE's thread in, like the OEM one. A good investment!

The factory WJ TRE's are pretty strong. Bigger then a ZJ's. With a 24mm thread, they are almost 1 inch.

To flip the tie rod:
I used the inserts from www.goferitoffroad.com They are too long for the WJ's knuckles, so cut them shorter, so they come within 1/16"-1/8" from the bottom of the knuckle hole. They need to be shorter so when you tighten the TRE nut, it makes contact with the knuckle, not the insert. You could also grind them flush to the bottom of the knuckle. You drill out your knuckles, slip them in (don't forget to cut shorter, or grind flush when done) and weld the top of them to the knuckle. You now have your tie rod on top.

Note: pop the rubber boot off a TRE and slip it in the newly welded insert. Make sure you have around .090" gap to the top of the TRE. The rubber boot is about that thick (with a metal washer inside). You want to make sure that when the TRE is tighten in the insert, that the rubber boot is not making contact with the insert, or your TRE will not be tight. If you don't have the correct clearance, after welding, grind a little off the top of the weld.

To keep your front sway bar, move the passenger sway bar mounts to the inside (see pics).

To keep maximum turning radius, cut the little piece of metal at your track bar mount and notch your driver side spring perch (see pics).

Now make a little bracket to mount your SS to the driver side lower sway bar mount. Re-use the SS mount to the tie rod. (see pics).

Drag Link improvement:
The reason Teraflex and Rock Krawler sell those Drop Pitman Arms and Track Bar drop brackets is because the WJ's pitman TRE does not allow enough droop starting just taller then a 2" lift on a WJ (using shorter shocks).

A 4" lift kit for a WJ with longer shocks (26"), has both the DPA and TB drop bracket, because the stock draglink TRE will bind with shocks at that length with out them. I have suspension cycled the WJ in the garage to make sure my draglink was NOT acting like a limiting strap. It was! So I added a DPA (a la bumpsteer), then a TB bracket. It never stayed tight and my spring hit it, my axle hit it....what a mess.

Better way...
To keep your stock pitman arm, use a Chevy High misalignment TRE at the pitman arm end (ES2027L) and the stock drag link WJ TRE at the passenger hub side of the drag link. (See pics)

The Chevy TRE thread is 7/8-18L and the WJ TRE is 24mm-xxR. How to make that work on the same tube?

I bought a WJ tie rod (no TRE's), which is bigger then the drag link tube, but necks down to the 24mm thread at both ends. Use your stock drag link WJ TRE at the pass hub side and buy a Posion Spyder Tube adapter (7/8-18L) and jam nut for the pitman arm side. Cut the tie rod tube to length and weld the tube adapter in place.

You will have to machine your pitman arm for the Chevy TRE. The taper is different then the WJ TRE, I believe it was 8 degrees. A machine shop did that for me for a six pack. Just bring your pitman arm and the Chevy TRE to match up the angle to CNC it.

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If you don't want to do all that, you can keep your stock drag link, but you must modify the TRE on the passenger side end.

Cut the drag link TRE, rotate it and weld a plate on it for increased strength. (See pics).

Now you can mount it on top of the knuckle with the angle pointing the correct direction.

Update:

I picked up a Right Hand Drive (steering wheel on Right side) -- Right Hand Thread -- TRE for the Knuckle Side of the Drag Link from the Jeep Dealer. Jeep P/N is 52088512

It has the same exact bend that our Drag Link TRE has, just the opposite direction. So, you can use this TRE on top of your knuckle, to clear your spring.

No need to fab a custom TRE for the swap, just buy one at the Jeep Dealer or at: http://www.jeep4x4center.com/grand_c...sionWJ9904.htm I posted a Pic of it in the next post.

Note: you need wheels with more back spacing to clear the drag link TRE. 16" wheels need 5" of BS to clear it. I have a set of 16x8 with 5" of BS and 15x8 with 3.75" of BS. Factory 16x7 with 6" of BS will hit the TRE, I have tried it.

Note: you need to flip both your Tie Rod and your Drag Link. If you try to just flip your Tie Rod, the TRE on the passenger side Tie Rod, will hit the Drag Link TRE above it on the knuckle. It looks like it might work, but it won't. You need to flip both.

[JohnBoulderCO]

Here are some pics of the drag link and pitman arm mod.

Also, you can now cut off the factory SS mount on the bottom of the axle. One less thing for a rock to hang you up on.

EDIT: The last pic is of the RHD TRE.

[death-mobile]

I can't tell in the picture, but are you using a lowering bracket on the track bar still? If I were to use the Chevy TRE and the stock pitman arm, cut and weld the passenger side draglink TRE and flip it on top, would I need to get rid of the track bar lowering bracket? The modification is awsome, but at the moment...I'm more interested in the driveablity of my WJ. Would you suggest the drag-link mod as far as better steering?

[JohnBoulderCO]

No on the drop bracket for the track bar. No on the drop pitman arm. That bolt you see is above the standard track bar bolt. I'm going to mount a center limiting strap there.

You could still run a drop trackbar bracket, but why bother.


I did the track bar mod BEFORE I flipped my tie rod to get more droop. With the TRE on top, you might be OK with out the Chevy pitman TRE. But, you would have to check. I really did it to make sure there was zero bind on my drag link. That causes TRE's to fail and steering pumps to wear out.

BTW, all that oil you notice on my steering pump is from the high pressure line leaking a few months back. That hose cost a few $$$ from the dealer, not too hard to install.

[nate]

Just an FYI, my brother makes those inserts. I think he's charging $15 shipped which is a bit cheaper than Go Fer It.

[JohnBoulderCO]

That's right! Sorry, forgot about you having those as well. I did this mod last fall, just got around to writing it up. I got a lot of questions about it, so I figured it was time to share.

[luvthejeep]

i liked everything untill...



the cheby swap is the right way to do it- even if your welding skills are good, some peoples arent and this kinda sends the wrong message- nice solution toa problem though- cool read

[Mtn WJ]

Nice write up John. I happen to be going to the Fab Palace next week to have my TRE welded up. I will have this done in a week or two after that.

Yea I would not trust most people to weld this properly. Especially myself however Bob is pretty good with a TIG welder and adding the extra brace as shown gives a little extra piece of mind.

[JohnBoulderCO]

Thanks guys.
The problem with the WJ is there is zero room for the drag link TRE. It has to have that angle or it will hit your spring. If you don't move the sway bar disco to the other side, the TRE will hit that too.

You need angles in the tie rod TRE's as well for clearance and I still had to cut things to keep my turning radius.

If you could run the staight 1 ton TRE's I would have, but they won't fit on the WJ's stock axle. I bought a set, tried to make them work, couldn't, so I gave them to Corey/Cristi as a Baby Shower gift. Not sure if the kid plays with them or not.

I didn't do the welding myself. Bob (Trango) in Boulder did. He TIG welded it. I trust it.

[ogdak]

good write-up.

[Mtn WJ]

I have seen Johns set up and it looks great. Definately one of the best mods going for WJs especially if you wheel in the rocks. I have bent and broken way to many steering stablizers and tie rods. The Stabilzer you can live with out but a broken tied stick er a rod is not a good thing. Most of the time with the stock Tie rod they will crack at the rear portion where it necks down which is also where you will not necessarily see it. Then you could be cruising the highway and guess what it breaks.

[JohnBoulderCO]

From Carnage Canyon last August. I had enough, it was time to flip the tie rod and buy a stronger one too. Keith is right, notice where it breaks, at the point of neck down. Kinda like a D35 shaft's neck down area. Also notice that even with the SS up higher, the tie rod bent up and dented the SS body. And yes, I did see the rock. It isn't that big and I was starting to climb over it when the tie rod snapped. I think it was flexed (fatigue) one too many times from previous rocks and it was time to break.

[Northtrails]

Thanks for the write-up. I am still running without a SS after pancaking the last 2. I need this flip.

[Creech]

Interseting. I may look into doing the flip. I hit my TR on a big rock a couple weeks ago and was thinking there's gotta be a better place for this thing. That might allow me to use my knuckle attachement point for the sterring again.

I haven't had a steering stabilizer for over two years, just good geometry.

[ArloGuthroJeep]

Any reason I couldn't move my (actually add another) SS to where you have yours now?

[JohnBoulderCO]

Thanks.

Another way to do the drag link would be to bend the drag link at the knuckle end. Make it look like a "J" to clear the spring.

You could then use a big Chevy TRE at the knuckle end (providing your rims have enough offset to clear the TRE). Adjusting the drag link would be a little harder, you would have to pop the TRE out of knuckle, then rotate to correct length. You would also be limited to only full turns, no fine tuning to get the steering wheel location exact.

Just another way to do it.

[JohnBoulderCO]

Another way:
I was replacing my 2027L TRE at the pitman arm today. Noticed at Moab last weekend that it was getting a little sloppy. Everything wears out.

While under the Jeep, I was looking at the drag link and wondering what the Right Hand drive WJ's drag link would look like.

Did a little Googling and found that the Right Hand drive WJ has a different TRE part number at the knuckle then the Left Hand drive TRE. Both use the same pitman arm TRE. Which means, maybe the Right Hand drive TRE has the correct bend to put on top of the knuckle and clear the spring.

If so, you wouldn't have to cut and weld the Left Hand drive TRE.

Why didn't I think of this before? Maybe since it worked, I didn't think about improving on it until I was replacing a worn out TRE.

I'm going to stop by the Jeep dealer to take a look. My fear is that it won't have the same bend, maybe the spring perches are different enough the bend isn't needed or isn't as much, for the Right Hand drive WJ.

I hope it has the same bend, so the welded TRE step could be eliminated!

[ArloGuthroJeep]

You pulled that from this very informative post
http://www.colorado4x4.org/vbb/showp...4&postcount=17

[JohnBoulderCO]

This is what I found:
http://www.jeep4x4center.com/grand_c...sionWJ9904.htm
Item #10 has two different part numbers.

Yes, I saw that thread on CO4x4 last night. Your link doesn't work.

Both of you guys are saying Left Hand drive and Right Thread.

I want to look at the Right Hand Drive (steering wheel location) and Right Thread TRE and see if it will work.

The TRE he used doesn't look like it has enough of a bend to work on our WJ's.

It looks like he used one of the Tie Rod TRE's, since the bend isn't very much.

Edit:
The guy on that thread just confirmed this morning, he is using the OEM TRE from the Tie Rod, with the Right Hand Thread. Not the Right Hand Drive Drag Link TRE, which I want to investigate.

Adam (Jeepin' Wolf), who pioneered this mod (see my first post) used the OEM TRE from the Tie Rod, but had to give up some turning radius.

[Northtrails]

You can also go here www.kragen.com for some pics on the TREs, both knuckle and steering.







http://www.partsamerica.com/ProductD...ype=80&PTSet=A

[JohnBoulderCO]

I stopped by NAPA and flipped through the Chassis book looking at the Moog TRE's. They don't make one. Off to the Jeep dealer tomorrow.

[Nonstop]

Sorta noobie ? here... Iall my Tierod ends are torn up, and I just ordered Kevins WJ Tie rod and Drag link, I think his are 1 1/4" , I have all new Moog parts for the ends and am fine with thier strength/size for what we do down here, but as far as flex goes I do not want my Drag link end being the limiting factor as it seems... Anyone think it is possible to just drill and tap the Kevins Drag link/Pitman arm end for the flexy Chebby end, and thread it on there, ream the Drag link and call it a decent solution, wouldn't this add a degree or few of flex..... obviously without going the complet flip route, yet,...Can't see why not.. Thanks for any contribution

[JohnBoulderCO]

I haven't seen Kevin's Drag Link, so I don't know if there is enough "meat" to tap it to the Big Chevy end. If you could, you would need the Left Hand thread tap for the TRE.

[Jim311]

Mine droops pretty fawkin far and if you look at it, the ends really aren't at that much of an angle.

[Jim311]

I haven't seen Kevin's Drag Link, so I don't know if there is enough "meat" to tap it to the Big Chevy end. If you could, you would need the Left Hand thread tap for the TRE.

If you were concerned about it, I think you'd be better off just buying some DOM and having it threaded. I think at some point it's an excercise in futility though since I think the WJ TREs are going to be stronger than your drag link or tie rod unless you use some seriously thick shit. Kevin's is really not that thick.. mine is bent.