Thread: Family Wagon 1996 ZJ BUILD Cantilever Rear Suspension

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  1. #201 Re: Family Wagon 1996 ZJ BUILD Cantilever Rear Suspension 
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    Do you have any of those symptoms with your hydro assist setup? I doubt it or you have an issue.

    Full hydro stop working because you have no mechanical linkage. And the orbital needs to act like a hydraulic pump once the pump fails. Hydro assist still has a mechanical linkage and when you rotate the steering wheel the port opens on the steering box allowing the fluid to flow through. You will not have any different affect with my setup that you would with any other hydro assist setup. If the pump looses power it still steer like normal.

    I am not re-engineering the wheel here. I am just using the internals of the ram as the mechanical linkage instead of using a dedicated tie rod.

    You need to get the idea that because it looks like full hydro it will act like it .
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  2. #202 Re: Family Wagon 1996 ZJ BUILD Cantilever Rear Suspension 
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    This is awesome! One of the reasons I haven't done hydro assist is losing the good street driving steering characteristics. This set up should eliminate those factors! You definitely have to post up about how it steers on the street! I've never seen anyone doing this! I think it's a great idea and makes total sense! Do you have any links to other builds doing something similar?
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  3. #203 Re: Family Wagon 1996 ZJ BUILD Cantilever Rear Suspension 
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    Sorry if our questions offended you, they weren't supposed to, I was just very interested in how it worked in a failure situation because I have not actually seen this before.

    I really like the idea and want to see how this works out!
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  4. #204 Re: Family Wagon 1996 ZJ BUILD Cantilever Rear Suspension 
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    +1 no offense intended, I've learned so so much from your builds, I'd never dream of questioning your ability to execute innovative modifications.

    I should sit back and watch since I have no real world experience with either hydro assist or full hydro, just lots of research for when I add it to my rig.

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  5. #205 Re: Family Wagon 1996 ZJ BUILD Cantilever Rear Suspension 
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    I’m not offended by any means. I had this thought in 2004 and have discussed this with people for years since then. Every time people come back to the fact that they see a double ended ram and think it will act like full hydro when the motor is off. The double ended ram is only a hydraulic cylinder with a rod coming out both ends. Because it has a rod on both side of the piston the volume is the same and it has equal power and equal speed in both directions. Other than that it operates the same as a single ended ram.

    The factor that makes a full hydraulic system not work is because the pump needs to flow fluid in order to move the wheels. When it is not you have to turn the steering wheel which acts like a manual fluid pump. It is VERY Inefficient in pumping fluid so it is very difficult to steer the wheels. The ram has ZERO affect on this phenomenon.

    The hydraulic assist system uses a mechanical linkage to drive the knuckles. When you turn your steering wheel it opens a port and allows fluid to pass through the steering box in the direction you are turning. When the pressure is equalized from the steering whee to the sector shaft the port closes. No fluid is pushing the steering shaft in the box. We tap into the steering box at the location of the ports and instead of using the fluid to help rotate the sector shaft we’re rout it to a hydraulic ram. A ram is significantly more efficient at using the force of the fluid. That is why you get an advantage with hydro assist VS regular power steering. When you tap into the steering box you are still using the valving in the box as normal. So when the motor is off the system still steers. The steering box allows the fluid to flow freely through it as the ram travels and the mechanical linkage move the knuckles. No different that if you didn’t have a ram.

    The point I was making is that you need to loose the idea that it is a double ended ram that gives full hydro its shitty characteristics. I will say this again, the ram has ZERO affect on that.

    no offence taken here. i was typing on my phone late last night so i was a bit short. These discussions are important and what used to make this forum what it was. keep it coming boys!

    on to progress....shits getting real tight or a drag link. this is fll bump and the drag link will hit the oil pan. looks like i may need to clearance it a bit.








    Last edited by Kraqa; 01-26-2016 at 11:57 AM.
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  6. #206 Re: Family Wagon 1996 ZJ BUILD Cantilever Rear Suspension 
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    That makes sense, I dig it. Looks like an awesome way to help take some force off the passenger knuckle and share the load of the ram.

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  7. #207 Re: Family Wagon 1996 ZJ BUILD Cantilever Rear Suspension 
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    i got the steering box tapped today for the hydro assist lines. plus i got the front bumper all finished and the rad support finished so they will go off to the powdercoater tomorrow.


    i had to modify the factory pitman arm . this is at full bump








    ride height






    i am amazed at how tight this got up front, but i really wanted my 5" of up travel.


    basically i need to mount my air bumps up front, machine my tie rod ends, then do som e gussets and a ram skid then i can send the axle out for powdercoating.


    shits getting close!!!
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  8. #208 Re: Family Wagon 1996 ZJ BUILD Cantilever Rear Suspension 
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    The quality of your work never ceases to amaze me, that has to be the tightest fitment I've seen.

    I hope you can make it to gsw so we can all see this beast in person!

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  9. #209 Re: Family Wagon 1996 ZJ BUILD Cantilever Rear Suspension 
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    How are you going to be reinforcing the pitman arm? I recently noticed a hairline crack in mine, you obviously had a much bigger crack in it at one point lol.
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  10. #210 Re: Family Wagon 1996 ZJ BUILD Cantilever Rear Suspension 
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    Dave, i'm going to plate the top and bottom then wrap a band of 3/16" material all the way around it.
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  11. #211 Re: Family Wagon 1996 ZJ BUILD Cantilever Rear Suspension 
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    front bumper and rad support are at the powdercoater. I will be disassembling my LED light bars to get them powdercoated white as well.


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  12. #212 Re: Family Wagon 1996 ZJ BUILD Cantilever Rear Suspension 
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    I got the 2 rigid and 1 Chinese LED light bars apart last night. Sandblasted them today and sent them out to be powdercoating. I'm hoping they will be all coated tomorrow. Yeehaawwww.
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  13. #213 Re: Family Wagon 1996 ZJ BUILD Cantilever Rear Suspension 
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    SOOOOOOOOOOO...............This will be easy done it time for GSW..................See you there!!
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  14. #214 Re: Family Wagon 1996 ZJ BUILD Cantilever Rear Suspension 
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    There is still tons to do. Not including paint.

    I'm not rushing this. Steady progress to get the vehicle I want in the end. I am also considering selling my house. Huge spike in property value. I can make 150 - 200k on my house. It will get me into property with a real shop. Not this urban 2 car garage shit I have now.
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  15. #215 Re: Family Wagon 1996 ZJ BUILD Cantilever Rear Suspension 
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    #allwhiteeverything

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  16. #216 Re: Family Wagon 1996 ZJ BUILD Cantilever Rear Suspension 
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    i got the LED light bars disassembled and sandblasted, then had slicknic powdercoat them.











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  17. #217 Re: Family Wagon 1996 ZJ BUILD Cantilever Rear Suspension 
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    Yeah! White power!

    Wait... that didn't come out right.
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  18. #218 Re: Family Wagon 1996 ZJ BUILD Cantilever Rear Suspension 
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    i got the belly skid brackets fabbed and installed




















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  19. #219 Re: Family Wagon 1996 ZJ BUILD Cantilever Rear Suspension 
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    I started on the from ram and tiered rod protection. Still lots left to do.



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  20. #220 Re: Family Wagon 1996 ZJ BUILD Cantilever Rear Suspension 
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    I really like the boatside concept on the belly skid brackets. And it looks like you'll never have an issue with the bolt heads getting smashed into uselessness.
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  21. #221 Re: Family Wagon 1996 ZJ BUILD Cantilever Rear Suspension 
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    sneak peek for those who aren't on facebook and instagram.


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  22. #222 Re: Family Wagon 1996 ZJ BUILD Cantilever Rear Suspension 
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  23. #223 Re: Family Wagon 1996 ZJ BUILD Cantilever Rear Suspension 
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    Where do you find the time??? I can barely get outside to do the little things on the jeep let alone this...nice work as always!


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  24. #224 Re: Family Wagon 1996 ZJ BUILD Cantilever Rear Suspension 
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    I have a very understanding wife. Lol. I also had to pull the tranny in the buggy and rebuild that cause I blew it the other weekend.

    Thanks for the props.

    I am very motivated to get this thing done. Our housing market is retarded right now cause of Chinese investors. My house was worth 480 a month ago and my neighbor just sold for over 600. So we are trying to sell this place and buy a few acres to build a house. Things are going to get real crazy. Real fast.
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  25. #225 Re: Family Wagon 1996 ZJ BUILD Cantilever Rear Suspension 
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    Awesome work it looks great!
    WJ, 4.7, Clayton's Front, Double Triangulated Rear, 231HD, HP44, 8.8, ARBs, TR Bumpers, Hydro Assist, 35's, Cage
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