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Deltron
02-24-2006, 07:45 PM
Im gonna tri link my rear RE long arms over springbreak and was wondering which joint I should use and which way is best to mount it. My buddy 4 linked his and used Krawler joints mounted with the bolt horizontal and blew at least one joint if not both uppers at the axle end. I know krawler joints suck but still, what if I mounted it with the bolt going vertical, seems like the joint could handle side to side forces better this way, but that might be too much force on the bolt. I am using a 2.5" JJ on the axle side and reusing my RE joints on the frame. Finally I am attaching the truss to the housing on my 44A by drilling through the blue dot in the pic on each side of the housing and bolting some 1/4" plate to it using 3/4" bolts, then welding the plate to the truss...any thoughts on my ideas or suggestions for me would be appreciated. is the 2.5 JJ strong enough for this application.
-3030

luvthejeep
02-24-2006, 08:35 PM
so wait your truss is going to be made out of aluminum? :eek:

Deltron
02-24-2006, 08:45 PM
no truss will be made like most trusses, 2x2 box, the plate will also be steel but since I can't weld it to the housing I was gonna bolt it through the hole in the picture.

Kraqa
02-25-2006, 12:20 AM
weld the truss to the axle tubes do not bolt it to the housing that will weakin the housing.

I woudl use a 3" JJ that what i'm going to use on mine.

krawler joints suck ass. it dosn't matter what way you mount the bolt but i woudl do it horizontally.

RUYellow
02-25-2006, 02:47 AM
I trussed my 44A.

Large detailed pics, so I only linked them.

Here is the piece of 2x2 -.25 box and how it turned out.

http://www.ruyellow.com/Pictures/Jeep/1600x1200/Rear%20Truss/picture%201013.jpg

http://www.ruyellow.com/Pictures/Jeep/1600x1200/Rear%20Truss/picture%201014.jpg

Just make your cuts, insert it into your reciever hitch and stand on it. that is how I bent mine, no problem if it is cut even.

http://www.ruyellow.com/Pictures/Jeep/1600x1200/Rear%20Truss/picture%201015.jpg

Here it is finished, I built my brackets all the way down to the tubes because the truss span is so wide. Note measure from bucket to bucket to get center, the tubes are not the same length.

http://www.ruyellow.com/Pictures/Jeep/1600x1200/Rear%20Truss/picture%201056.jpg

Close up of the truss weld angle at the axle.

http://www.ruyellow.com/Pictures/Jeep/1600x1200/Rear%20Truss/picture%201065.jpg

I have now changed the upper mounts to be much closer, I never had any noticible laterial movement, just needed different geometry.

http://www.ruyellow.com/Pictures/Jeep/1600x1200/Rear%20Truss/picture%201985.jpg

No personal experience with a 3 link rear, but it seems like the lateral forces on the JJ would be better handled if it was mounted vertical. If that will not allow for the droop you are looking for, you might want to consider a triangulated 4 link.

Deltron
02-25-2006, 03:46 AM
Kraqa I think your right about using a 3" joint but my bank account disagrees. we'll see, i might break down and get one. As for the bolt, I will probably go horizontal, but just to know would it be dangerous to go vertical? Will a 3/4" grade 8 bolt shear under the stress of a tri link? My guess is unlikley, but possible. And you fuckin rule RUYellow for the pics, Ive already got ideas runnin through my head. My plan for bolting the truss to the housing was to keep the tubes from spinning, can you explain to me how this weakens the axle/truss??? As for the 4 link, I am fond of 3 links, I don't know why but I am so...."Tequila was invovled, get of me!" Thanks again for the pics, the measurements give me a great place to start. I'll post some pics when I finish. peace
david

nate
02-25-2006, 11:46 AM
If your going to setup a suspension, I would not skimp and get junk rod ends, etc. JJs aren't that expensive.

RUYellow
02-25-2006, 01:51 PM
Having used JJ and RE Superflex joints, I would use the RE. The UHMW composite that the RE Joints use for bushings would handle the side load better than the rubber compound used by JJ's.

Both are great products, so use what you want, just my opinion.

Kraqa
02-25-2006, 02:18 PM
the urtethane in the JJ will not destroy in a 3 link. Currie uses a relativly hard durometer of urethane with has 100% memory. The good thing about the urethane is that it has a little give to it. i'v never herd of guy snapping bolt with JJ's althorugh i have seen more then i would thought snap bolt with the re joints.

Yes you are right the UHMW is harder. it will wear better. but ask your self this. how often do you hear of guys wearing out JJ's? personnaly i'v only seen one guy and that was Matt (overkill) and he did it by choice there was no practical reason he did it.


As for the truss. RUYellow's design is great. i liek the tie in's and i'm a huge fan of flat bar. If your goign to truss a AL44 i woudl go RUyellows rout. it ties it in in 4 locations and it spans a large area on the housing. this is especially good for a aluminum center section.

I opted for a more low profile design to allow for a very low amount of lift required. i did not want my arms contacting the floor boards and i didn't want the truss to contact the gas tank. Keep in mine i'm trussing a d70 on 38's so i had to stretch my WB significantly.

I welded each side on imdependantly. this allowed for minimal measurment and i coudl hug the pumkin closely. I woudl not recomend this methode for a d35 or d44 because you might try to huge the pumkin to close and not have enought roon on the top for your suspension mounts.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v280/Kraqa/Axle1.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v280/Kraqa/back.jpg

I trimmed the top portion off the material makign it parallel with the axle tubes.

Then skipping the steps on how to make the link mounts i welded 1/2" flat bar ontop of the side peices

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v280/Kraqa/firstcoat.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v280/Kraqa/blingbling.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v280/Kraqa/Suspension/DSC02808.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v280/Kraqa/Suspension/DSC02810.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v280/Kraqa/Suspension/DSC02811.jpg

Deltron
02-25-2006, 03:04 PM
Thanks again for the help, RUYellow I plan on ripping your design off and taking the credit for myself :) Is it possible to spin a tube once the truss has been welded on and the links attached? that was my biggest concern and one i wanted to address when building the truss. nice pics kraqa.

Kraqa
02-25-2006, 03:52 PM
you wont spin a tube you will sping the pumkin. but it is harder to do this because essencially you will have to sping both tubes at once.

RUYellow
02-25-2006, 03:58 PM
Thanks again for the help, RUYellow I plan on ripping your design off and taking the credit for myself :) Is it possible to spin a tube once the truss has been welded on and the links attached? that was my biggest concern and one i wanted to address when building the truss. nice pics kraqa.

You're welcome.

I believe that spinning a tube would be more likely to occur one side at a time. With the sides welded together with a truss, I feel safe that I will not spin a tube. The truss spans the forces accross a large area, I think you would have a better chance of snapping or bending a shaft before spinning a tube.

Deltron
02-25-2006, 06:05 PM
currie doesn't make a 3" JJ with the stud welded on, just the 2.5, does anyone know of a joint that would work well in this application with a stud already welded on? and isn't there an tube insert out there for 2x2 box? sorry for all the questions

Kraqa
02-25-2006, 08:32 PM
why not weld the stud on


no big deal.


or get an evolution joint there freekin gawsome.

Deltron
02-25-2006, 11:32 PM
I went, I saw, I MUST HAVE!

nathaniel
02-26-2006, 12:30 AM
While most people horizontally mount a 4 link at the axle it isn't the correct way to do it. it should be vertical esppecially if its a tri link. If the bolt is at static ride height 90* to the arm then you have like 20+8 of down travel which is like 2 feet of down travel. Only reason people do it horizontal is its easy and requires no work. Weld 4 tabs on and your done. My 4 link is mounted like this with small rubber bushing and I dont have any problems with it. I would like to swap to the large rubber bushings that way I dont have to replace them every couple of years.

chadjans
02-26-2006, 12:38 AM
One joint on the axle = bolt vertical.
Two joints on the axle = bolts horizontial.

Chad

Deltron
02-26-2006, 04:11 AM
thanks

Kraqa
02-26-2006, 07:00 AM
One joint on the axle = bolt vertical.
Two joints on the axle = bolts horizontial.

Chad

care to elaborate as to why?

RUYellow
02-26-2006, 11:46 AM
care to elaborate as to why?

The joints are built to withstand huge amounts of pressure perpendicular to the bolt hole. So on a control arm they work well, the bolt is horizontal, side to side. The main forces are applied from front to rear.

On a three link you are asking it to withstand all of its normal axle location duties, front to rear, but also huge amounts of side load.

Look at the construction; it is easy to see that if you are pushing on it side to side and the bolt is vertical, the race supports the bushings.

If you are pushing on it side to side, and the bolt is horizontal. The forces are being applied to the joint, trying to push the center out of the race. It is just like putting it into a press and seeing how much force it will take before it comes apart.

So, yes if you have 1 joint, make it big. As stated above if you are doing 4 link, obviously 2 joints, but you can run them horizontal. This is because the 2 joints will then share the side to side (lateral) forces.

Kraqa
02-26-2006, 01:04 PM
ya reading this now i dont' knwo why i asked the question. i was very drunk last night. and i'm paying for it right now.


....off to go puke.

luvthejeep
02-26-2006, 07:29 PM
ya reading this now i dont' knwo why i asked the question. i was very drunk last night. and i'm paying for it right now.


....off to go puke.

hahahahaha

excuses, excuses... :finga:

chadjans
02-26-2006, 10:13 PM
care to elaborate as to why?

Well yellow explained it but it all has to do with load distribution.

Chad :cheer2:

luvthejeep
02-26-2006, 11:25 PM
Well yellow explained it but it all has to do with load distribution.

Chad :cheer2:

actually it has nothing to do with load distribution- it dose have to do with the direction of forces, were building a 3-link here, not loading groceries :finga:

chadjans
02-27-2006, 01:51 AM
Sure. I know three is greater than four. With four joints you would be distributing forces over four joints instead of three. Therefore each joint in the system would be required to take less of the load hence distributing the load.

luvthejeep
02-27-2006, 09:09 AM
thats correct if we were talking about how many links to run, it was allywas going to be 3 not 4, the question was why do we run the upper joint vertical, the direction of the forces lateraly can correctly be held by the joint bolt being run verticly- but i understand why you said that-

Deltron
02-27-2006, 10:24 AM
Ok blah blah blah, we now all agree vertical is the way to go with the 3 link. In more important news though...evo is sending something kickass across the border for me...and its not BC bud :)

redzj
02-27-2006, 02:51 PM
I built my 3 link with the bolt horizontal no problems so far but it hasn't been on ther real long. I guess I will see how it holds up.