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View Full Version : Electric Lockers, whats your take on them?



Fatty-McGee
12-11-2005, 12:14 PM
Being that these are fairly new, i was wondering if anybody had any experience with these lockers such as the detroit electrac, or the auburn or any others.

http://www.babeskickass.com/pics/hot-chick-with-big-tits.jpg

OverkillZJ
12-11-2005, 12:25 PM
No personal experience. My buddy did cook a Detroit electrac, and a couple vendors wouldn't even sell me the elocker I wanted for my 60... So I decided just to order up an ARB and deal with the air line crap.

I don't know, they could be great, but I didn't want to be a $700 Ginni pig :)

ATL ZJ
12-11-2005, 01:51 PM
:smt118 Is that pic a reward for reading your post?


I spoke at length with one of the Eaton engineers about their e-locker at a 4 wheel convention type thing. I appoached him skeptical and left impressed. We all know the benefits of a selectable locker, especially in a dual purpose vehicle. I run an ARB, which depends on electricity AND air. Using electricity alone just simplifies the process. It could really end up cheaper if you don't have an air source. There is probably a good reason why Toyota uses e-lockers in their Landcruisers, 4runners, and Tacomas stock.

OverkillZJ
12-11-2005, 02:17 PM
:smt118 Is that pic a reward for reading your post?
I run an ARB, which depends on electricity AND air. Using electricity alone just simplifies the process.

Not the greatest logic I've ever seen. Point in fact is that electrical components hanging on a diff cover or in a diff are much mroe susceptible to damage from water, impact, etc, than a pneumatically actuated one.

I was told they get a lot of returns from a vendor I buy many parts from, but like I said I've had no experience with it. I was obviously hooked on the idea considering I tried buying one, but after my buddies Electrac experience and my vendor cautioning me, I decided I'd just live with the air lines. I went tried and true considering I'd rather not build a $4,000 axle more than once... But it could be awesome I dunno!

I'm not really arguing for or against it, just pointing out that Cam didn't have his brain Wheaties yet today :finga:

ATL ZJ
12-11-2005, 02:29 PM
Not the greatest logic I've ever seen. Point in fact is that electrical components hanging on a diff cover or in a diff are much mroe susceptible to damage from water, impact, etc, than a pneumatically actuated one.

I was told they get a lot of returns from a vendor I buy many parts from, but like I said I've had no experience with it. I was obviously hooked on the idea considering I tried buying one, but after my buddies Electrac experience and my vendor cautioning me, I decided I'd just live with the air lines. I went tried and true considering I'd rather not build a $4,000 axle more than once... But it could be awesome I dunno!

I'm not really arguing for or against it, just pointing out that Cam didn't have his brain Wheaties yet today :finga:

Well thanks. Piss on my credibility.

Let's take a real world example. How about, say, last wheeling trip. Sometimes driveshafts break on the trail. Well, one did on my buddy's rig. The thing pretzeled and separated at the splines as it got shorter. It continued to spin, as all good driveshafts do. It happened to take out the ARB line. Had it been a wire, we could have spliced it in seconds. But we didn't have an air line repair kit, so we were out of luck.

E-locker relies on wires alone.
Air locker relies on wires and air lines.
It's not a hard concept.

OverkillZJ
12-11-2005, 02:43 PM
Ok, I was just joking around, but if you really want to get into an argument, fine with me.




E-locker relies on wires alone.
Air locker relies on wires and air lines.
It's not a hard concept.

E-locker relies on wires alone and electrical components in a harsh environment. It's not as simple as wires going to the diff. It's not magic.

Air locker relies on wires in an engine compartment and air lines in the harsh environment.

It's not a hard concept.


All I stated was that both have their ups and their downs, I never said one was better. I only said why I chose ARB. Nor did I say ANYTHING about your "credibility"

Now what, again, is your fucking problem? :smt038

ATL ZJ
12-11-2005, 02:53 PM
Ok, I was just joking around, but if you really want to get into an argument, fine with me.



E-locker relies on wires alone and electrical components in a harsh environment. It's not as simple as wires going to the diff. It's not magic.

Air locker relies on wires in an engine compartment and air lines in the harsh environment.
True. You also failed to mention that air lockers require more than air lines.. "It's not as simple as [an air line] going to the diff" (Weaver, Matt. "Electric Lockers, whats your take on them?" Post #6. 11 Dec 2005). All selectable differentials have something other than an open carrier on the inside. That goes without saying.

My point was that an air locker requires more external components in order to function. Pressure switch goes bad? sorry. Compressor locks up? sorry. York vbelt snaps? no locker. I could go on for hours.

This has nothing to do with which one is "better".. That depends on the vehicle, user, and purpose. I love my ARB.

zjcrazy
12-11-2005, 10:09 PM
stay away from eaton.

my friend had an eaton in his 8.8... a week later it blew up under some not so extreme circumstances.

zjcrazy
12-11-2005, 10:11 PM
Oh... and great pic btw

Fatty-McGee
12-12-2005, 07:16 AM
Judging by what everybody is saying, ill probably stay away from the electric lockers for now. I was a little skeptical when i saw a picture of the locker and the new diff cover they give you with all the electronics sitting over top the pumpkin. I mean i know theres not alot involved in the circuitry but the only thing that should be down there is steel.

KansasCrawlin
04-17-2006, 09:26 PM
don't mean to highjack, but what about OX lockers? I've got one insatlled in the hp44 going in my rig. I imagine they have thier own flaws too. just wanted a heads up of what shitty things i might need to expect. I just thought with no electrical crap to fry, it would make my life easier.

LouisianaZJ
04-18-2006, 01:46 AM
detroit no-spin

Swamp boy
04-18-2006, 11:50 PM
At least the Detroit electrac has manual switching component. so if you tear a wire or the electric motor craps out or whatever .. You can engage / disengage with a wrench... Thats a pretty good plus..

That said.. I wouldnt buy an electric locker I do to much deep water...


OX is pretty awesome once you get the cable adjusted right.. I know several guys who run them and they are all very happy with them...

J B
04-25-2006, 07:06 PM
At least the Detroit electrac has manual switching component. so if you tear a wire or the electric motor craps out or whatever .. You can engage / disengage with a wrench... Thats a pretty good plus..

Yeah, but all that crap hanging off the cover means it can get damaged...and neither the wrench nor the switch will help you then.


That said.. I wouldnt buy an electric locker I do to much deep water...

I chose Eaton Elockers for my axles. I don't have the axles built up yet, but as far as getting water inside the diff, the electrical part is a sealed coil. It's already in a bunch of gear oil, I doubt water is going to hurt it. Certainly less prone to any sort of seal leakage than an ARB would be.



OX is pretty awesome once you get the cable adjusted right.. I know several guys who run them and they are all very happy with them...

I have hard the same, but I hear the cables are tough to set up right and sometimes require adjustment.

phillyzj
05-10-2006, 12:58 PM
i don't know the electric locker technology, but i would guess it's similar to the electric hydraulic valve i've been playin with.

super simple to install, i just ran 12 volts to it and it works. so a relay, a switch, 12 volts and you are done.

my worries are about reliability. with air, the wear components for the most part are the compressor.

for my switch, the wear parts are in the actually hydraulic switch, it's got essentially a giant solenoid. the solenoid gets quite warm and seems like it could over heat or short, or for some other reason fail.

whether it's related or not, that's my take.

my main thoughts are that arb's been making selectable lockers for a long time and detroit has not, so i woul dprobably go with arb.

Mtn WJ
05-10-2006, 01:34 PM
You have to add the cost of a compressor to the ARB which makes them more expensive..

I have mixed opinions on ARBs. I have gone 4 years with no leaks or problems with one of them and the one in the front I have one know begins to leak every couple of months and I have to tear it down each time.

When I did my axle swap I specifically went with a Detroit. NO FUSS NO MUSS. IN the front its a different story and I will stick with the ARB I have for now. I will not likely buy another one again with all the options out there these days. I agree you have several variables like a compressor, air line, coupler, outer seals and an actuator. They all can leak.

OverkillZJ
05-10-2006, 01:40 PM
I've yet to run the ARB in my own setup, but I agree with Keith, if you can run a Detroit, do it. It's just so simple. I'm running detroit rear, ARB front.

I was tempted to do a detroit in the front again, but I'd like to be able to drive front wheel drive unlocked to make the easier trails a little more challenging.

Creech
05-12-2006, 08:03 AM
I have two close friends who put e-lockers in their TJ's. Both had to replace them in under a month because they just quit working. I watched one fight with his for 20 minutes on the trail and still never get it to lock. I wouldn't own one.

If you're just to shitty of a driver to drive with a locked rear end, and you gotta have selectability, then go with the ARB. Get the stainless line and route it carefully.

That's my $.02

J B
05-12-2006, 12:19 PM
Was this the eaton?

Creech
05-12-2006, 12:33 PM
I believe so, but I could be wrong. It was weird. He was trying to get over this obstacle, and it just wouldn't engage. He hit the switch several times and it didnt' make a difference. Ended up breaking something internal, so I don't think it was a fault of the electrics. This is behind a 2.5 and AX-5, so doubt he threw too much power to it. Company ended up replacing it for free, but it's still the hassle of replacing it.

nate
05-12-2006, 01:59 PM
Having an ARB in the back is nice if the rig is a DD and your seeing ice on the roads. That being said, I have a Detroit in the D70 under my truck, which is my DD and an ARB in the Jeep which is a trail rig. haha.

I've had the lines break on the ARB, the front a few times. It's not hard to repair. I just keep some extra line in the Jeep if I'd need it. I remember a while back people said the solenoids would fail all the time. I've been running the same ones for 4 years with no problems.
As for the air, it's not hard to plumb the ARB into your OBA system. No OBA? Well it's an excuse to set your self up with something. You could also buy a 5 gallon tank from Walmart and fill it up at home. I have a 2 gallon tank and I wheel all day without the compressor coming on.

When I put different axles under the Jeep it will probably be a spool in the back and a ARB in the front. When I wheel, I turn the rear locker on and I very rarely unlock it until I hit the street. I can deal with a spool since the Jeep sees only a thousand or two miles a year.

In the truck, I thought about an ARB, almost regret not doing it, but it was just too much money. The ARB was just under $800, while the Detroit was like $550.

Creech
05-12-2006, 02:15 PM
I kinda agree with Nate. My WJ only sees VERY limited road use. My first locker was a used Lockwrong and it held for a year under trail and road use. Once I got used to driving with a locker in the rear, it felt weird after I pulled it out.

The 9" I'm building for my junk right now will be spooled. Haven't decided on the front HP44 yet. Maybe OX, maybe ARB. Not sure. Haven't given it too much thought really.

My buddy Brad has been running his ARB plummed to a 5 gal. tank for almost three years now. No problems unless he forgets to turn his regulator to the right pressure.

ProjectZJOM617T
07-30-2006, 02:50 AM
What I like about the electrac is that it is a LSD and a locker...

Best of both worlds... Truetrac plus manual locker...

Skyline
09-21-2006, 11:26 PM
I am really liking the idea of these electric lockers, and thinking about it very seriously. My GC is not my DD, but as a resident of the North East, it IS my DD when there's snow on the ground. Assuming my wife takes the family 4 Runner, (which she usually does), that leaves me the choice of the GC or my RWD G35 in the snow. Last winter, I never even bothered to put the snows on the G35. And if there's snow on the ground I can usually be found driving north to the ski slopes. Work is definately cancelled if there's more than a couple of inches on the ground. I love driving in the snow. Since I've heard that lunchbox lockers can be not so great in the snow, a limited slip diff with a switch to lock it sounds ideal. And limited slips are great for snow/rain traction.

I gather I'd have to use two different brands to do front and rear. Auburn Ected for the front and Detroit Electric for the rear? (I have stock open D30 front and D44a rear). Anyone done this? The Auburn seems to be quite reasonable compared to other selectable lockers (~$550). Am I missing something here?

EMTimZJ
09-22-2006, 11:07 AM
For a DD mild wheeler the Auburn LSD will be fine. It really is not a locker and not a good choice for a vehicle oriented for trail performace.

The ECTED still relies on clutch packs when in "locked" mode, and CAN slip.

HTH

J B
09-22-2006, 11:35 AM
For a DD mild wheeler the Auburn LSD will be fine. It really is not a locker and not a good choice for a vehicle oriented for trail performace.

The ECTED still relies on clutch packs when in "locked" mode, and CAN slip.

HTH

Exactly, and none of these are available for the D44A, so you don't get any electric locker choices for that axle.

Skyline
09-22-2006, 01:15 PM
Exactly, and none of these are available for the D44A, so you don't get any electric locker choices for that axle.

I've seen prices for a Detroit electric locker for a D44. Are you saying that a locker that is designed for a D44 won't fit a D44a?

J B
09-22-2006, 01:19 PM
I've seen prices for a Detroit electric locker for a D44. Are you saying that a locker that is designed for a D44 won't fit a D44a?

Yes. Although the D44 and D44A appear to be similar, nothing is interchangeable.

Carriers (and that includes lockers), gearsets, axle retention....none of that is interchangeable.

The D44A isn't just a Dana 44 with an aluminum centersection.

Skyline
09-22-2006, 02:26 PM
Yes. Although the D44 and D44A appear to be similar, nothing is interchangeable.

Carriers (and that includes lockers), gearsets, axle retention....none of that is interchangeable.

The D44A isn't just a Dana 44 with an aluminum centersection.
SHIT.

Skyline
09-22-2006, 02:28 PM
So are there other selectable locker choices for the 44a? OX or ARB?

J B
09-22-2006, 03:03 PM
So are there other selectable locker choices for the 44a? OX or ARB?

Nope. You have ONE choice for a locker, and that's the Aussie lunchbox. Other than that, it's the factory limited slip.

Those are your options.

Skyline
09-22-2006, 11:10 PM
Nope. You have ONE choice for a locker, and that's the Aussie lunchbox. Other than that, it's the factory limited slip.

Those are your options.

OK that sucks. I guess I'll be looking for an 8.8 a bit sooner than I thought.

Anyone got any reports on how the Aussie does in the snow on-road???

HyenaZJ
09-23-2006, 09:41 AM
Stay away from the D30 ECTED! I've been "running" one for about 8 months and my rig has been in the shop twice to replace/repair the unit. Luckly the shop that I've been dealing with has been more than helpful in this mess. They have pulled the D30 ECTED's off their shelf due to other customers having the same problem. They are also in the process of swapping out the ECTED units for ARB's, I get mine next month!

gonecheenin
09-23-2006, 11:00 AM
For a DD mild wheeler the Auburn LSD will be fine. It really is not a locker and not a good choice for a vehicle oriented for trail performace.
HTH

I have one of those in my 84' Blazer's front 44, amazingly enough even with a flat tire in the rocks the posi kept both fronts turning.

Way better operation then i expected

KIDKRAWLER
09-23-2006, 05:06 PM
Just an opinion but I have run the electrac for the past 10k miles. It is the only front locker I have ever had. The limited slip is freaking awesome, I hardly ever switch out of it. But when I need to , it works perfectly to flip that switch and get full positive lock. I have NEVER had an issue with it. No electrical component problems nothing. I do water crossings alot in the canyons here, snow whelling is my favorite wheeling and it perfroms flawlessly. It was expensive, but I feel very worth it. The quality of the cover with it's electrical component shield is great, you have the option to mount it a couple of ways and it is very installer friendly.

ProjectZJOM617T
09-23-2006, 05:27 PM
The electracs are the shizzznit....

I'm going to run them fore and aft with greendiamond retread "snow mudders"

I wish there was a center diff upgrade for the t case that acted like a truetrac.. No VC crap just torq sensing gears! That would be awesome tq sensing or locked as options for all three diffys...

Skyline
09-23-2006, 07:39 PM
The electracs are the shizzznit....

I'm going to run them fore and aft with greendiamond retread "snow mudders"

I wish there was a center diff upgrade for the t case that acted like a truetrac.. No VC crap just torq sensing gears! That would be awesome tq sensing or locked as options for all three diffys...

Actually, my 2004 4Runner has something like that. It has an electric lock up for the transfer case. Button on the dash. Unfortunately, they did away with the electric locking axles, but the traction control works as somewhat of a substitute. When I first drove the 4Runner in deep snow, I thought it was horrible. it did not want to go strait.Then I found that button hidden under the dash, and it made a huge difference.

ProjectZJOM617T
09-23-2006, 08:04 PM
Well there is already a lock position on the Tcase for 4h and 4l...

A Tq biasing LSD center when unlocked would be nice..

Skyline
09-23-2006, 10:39 PM
Well there is already a lock position on the Tcase for 4h and 4l...

A Tq biasing LSD center when unlocked would be nice..

You should see the systems in the JDM only Skyline R34, or the JDM Mitsubishi EVO. The Skyline allows you to adjust torque bias front to rear at the push of a touch screen TV in the center console. The JDM EVO, has a computer controlled torque sensing center differential that is so hi-tech that they left it off the US cars; not wanting to add roughly $10k to the price. It will actually shift torque bias in the middle of a turn to improve corner exit speeds. I understand the next major redesign of the US EVO model will have this technology, as will the upcoming Nissan Skyline (which will also be sold in the US); both roughly 2008 some time. We are going to see some amazing technology in automobile drivetrains in the next dozen or so years...we can all hope a bit trickles down (or should I say trickles UP?) to off-road vehicles.

ProjectZJOM617T
09-23-2006, 11:01 PM
I had a DSM with alot of work including a GT35R and 1680cc injectors....

The nissan extroid CVT trans JDM only... Is awesome too..

Nissans drivetrains are much better than mitsubishi...

When it comes to capability durability and simplicity the true trac design wins..

Alot of the V8 pony car guys run the true tracks when their stock GM torqsen blow up.... The true trac is alot tougher..

Also look up the hydraulic hybrid F150 last ETA was 2008!

fr3db3ar
09-25-2006, 09:36 AM
I guess we all just need to put electric locking Toyota axles under our rigs :yumyum: :smt033

EMTimZJ
09-25-2006, 10:32 AM
I guess we all just need to put electric locking Toyota axles under our rigs :yumyum: :smt033

Yes, yes you do:D

Skyline
09-25-2006, 11:40 AM
I guess we all just need to put electric locking Toyota axles under our rigs :yumyum: :smt033

Just exactly how strong are these Toyota axles? I know that now that they are selling the 4Runner with a V8 they have eliminated the electric lockers. I was just wondering if these was a reason for this other than cost. Will these things stand up to the torque of a V8 combined with 33-35" tires and a 4:1 case? Are they as strong as an 8.8?

EMTimZJ
09-25-2006, 11:46 AM
Just exactly how strong are these Toyota axles? I know that now that they are selling the 4Runner with a V8 they have eliminated the electric lockers. I was just wondering if these was a reason for this other than cost. Will these things stand up to the torque of a V8 combined with 33-35" tires and a 4:1 case? Are they as strong as an 8.8?

Yes.

ProjectZJOM617T
09-26-2006, 05:09 AM
http://www.diamondaxle.com/front_steering.htm

http://www.diamondaxle.com/rear_nonsteering.htm

The toy axles can be a good platform... The only thing with the toy electric locker is that it is open or fully locked...

The electrac is torq biasing LSD or fully locked.. I like ATB diffs (automatic tq biasing).. They are just the ticket when a locker is the last thing you need... Like glare ice... I like lockers too for deep mud, snow and a tire or two off the ground situations... The electrac is the best of both worlds..

EMTimZJ
09-26-2006, 12:19 PM
http://www.diamondaxle.com/front_steering.htm

http://www.diamondaxle.com/rear_nonsteering.htm

The toy axles can be a good platform... The only thing with the toy electric locker is that it is open or fully locked...

The electrac is torq biasing LSD or fully locked.. I like ATB diffs (automatic tq biasing).. They are just the ticket when a locker is the last thing you need... Like glare ice... I like lockers too for deep mud, snow and a tire or two off the ground situations... The electrac is the best of both worlds..

Toy e-locker fully open or fully locked? You mean just like the ARB that people don't mind at all?;)

-Tim