buggy frame buildup

[paulkeith]

so, i took what was worth saving off my old "zheap" project...which basically boils down to the leafs, 14bolt, np205, sm465, and the 305.

we've got a tpi setup ready to go onto the motor. leaf mounts are 1/4" plate, shackle mounts are the MORE poly bushings with sleeves inside DOM. stupid 10bolt is still in the front. i bought 140' of DOM and HREW, and have a protools bender waiting to get the cage going. 21 gallon rci fuel cell. i ran out of time and money this summer...so for now i'm back in atlanta slugging away at the books.

got a clocking plate on the 205, too. things to be done are:

build a crossmember (got more MORE bushings for that purpose), buy the rest of the parts for the hydro steering...
box in the shackle mounts with 1/4" flat bar.

long term... find a damn d60 front when i start working again, build the cage, eventually swtich suspension to linked (what frame was designed with in mind)

wheelbase is ~104" and the cage design should allow a negative rear departure angle and almost 90* in the front once i get it linked.

welder is a sp-175 lincoln, pretty kickass. frame is remarkably square for welding it up on a concrete floor. by my best calculation, its off about 1/8" on 8'.

anywho, enjoy.


and a shot of moving the project from one house to another this summer:




a little better than my first try at this project thing, eh? its looking like i wont finish this til about 2007, but...whatever. i sold my dd jeep, so this is all i've got left to weld around on.

Paul

[OverkillZJ]

This should be a good read.

I'm starting my Phoenix-Buggy this weekend, and honesly I think the only reason I decided to cut down the unibody instead of making it from tube up is because I want to still say "this used to be my daily driver grand cherokee" and attend the grand slams.

I'm dumb.:coffee:

[paulkeith]

i wanted to try that, and did. kind of blew it, though....

this makes it soooo much easier to build simple, strong mounts for everything. granted; it does take away a little of the uniqueness. unibodys just make everything 10x harder and unless you're a badass, weaker.

its great to just be able to be like, i want a motor mount here...and you can weld on some 1/4" plate without thinking twice.

i hate having to be in atlanta and just think about this project instead of getting my hands dirty. oh well

[ATL ZJ]

Looking really good. Much better than last time :yawinkle:.



i hate having to be in atlanta and just think about this project instead of getting my hands dirty. oh well

I know exactly what you mean. Except for me it's the opposite, when I am in Atlanta, I'm working hard on the heep, and when I'm up at PC in SC, all I can do is plan...

[Kraqa]

holy pic size. did you miss the annoucment abotu that. 640x800

[TrojanMan]

i hate having to be in atlanta and just think about this project instead of getting my hands dirty. oh well

I know the feeling. My zj is in charlotte, I'm in raleigh. I finished it up about 2 weeks before I moved out, all i want to do now is finish the little tweaks and drive it.. but I can't:smt064

[Kraqa]

are you going to put an X brace in the middle arounf the tranny area? what wall thickness is that frame? final tire size.

[ELLLLLIOTTTTT]

no more crimped style cages please. :smt029

[paulkeith]

haha, fuckers....

yeah, i did miss the pic size thing. first time i've posted anythign since i sold my zj. what difference does it make? its only bandwidth on my pic server thats getting used. anyway, i'll get em resized when i get a chance.

there is still much triangulation that has to go inside the frame rails. there will be an "x" in the rear portion, behind the front "crossmember", and then whatever i can work out with the floor/tranny mount/etc.

frame thickness is 3/16". final tire size hopefully 40 or 42. maybe 38 depending on backspacing/turning radius/rubbing.

[JeepinHank]

Looking good.

Hope you saved the receipt on that GMC chop saw. If that's the only chop saw you're using, I guarantee you'll take advantage of that 2 year warranty.

Mine made it through 2 bumpers and half of my suspension build before it gave up the ghost. Luckily, I've got until this december before the 2yrs is up!

[Kraqa]

th epic size makes it super hard for peopel to veiw. It also makes it hard for dial up people.

[TrojanMan]

th epic size makes it super hard for peopel to veiw. It also makes it hard for dial up people.

I, and probably some other people too, prefer larger pics.

But then again you do have to cater to those without widescreen and high speed internet.

[Cue-Ball]

I, and probably some other people too, prefer larger pics.

But then again you do have to cater to those without widescreen and high speed internet.

I agree that the larger pictures are nice, but it does make the thread difficult to read for the majority of the users.

If you want to share your larger pictures, simply post a link to them and then people have the choice to follow the link for better detail or just stick with the smaller ones posted.

Besides I have dial up only at the house and it KILLS me when I am at home.

So Paul please resize your pictures and repost.

Thanks

Dirk

[deadman]

I always use 700x500

I don't mind the size (kb), but I hate scrolling around.

======================


Why did you go with a box frame, and not a full tube chassis?

[paulkeith]

aiight, gimme a chance to get em resized. school is a freakin disaster..



few reasons on the box tube. 1) i had it all already 2)simplicity of construction 3) simplicity of creating suspension mounts and adding the cage

i prodded a few folks over at pbb and here about it, and the consensus was for a first full-fab project, square would be the way to go for simplicity and learning's sake. saved me a bucketload, too.

[paulkeith]

back from the dead, bitches!
after two semesters of 15 hours each senior level aero engineering plus 15 hours of work a week and a 3.25 avg to boot, i'm back at the hack-fab game at night and the cubicle-jockey by day.

uncovered the pile and started on the crossmember. using MORE bushings and weld on tabs cuz i'm lazy :D. bolts will get sleeved, rest of the xmember should be done by tonight. once the drivetrain is in place, i can....you guessed it...start bending some tube.


http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/crossmember/Img_0892.jpg
http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/crossmember/Img_0897.jpg
http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/crossmember/Img_0895.jpg
http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/crossmember/Img_0896.jpg

have at it,
Paul

[OverkillZJ]

Forget the buggy; make a giant riding lawnmower out of it :-D

[paulkeith]

Forget the buggy; make a giant riding lawnmower out of it :-D

don't tempt me.

[AgitatedPancake]

don't tempt me.

Oh he is.

How big is the blade gunna be?

[paulkeith]

it'll be fiftyshutup inches

[paulkeith]

crossmember is done.

on slate from now until august is the cage. If i finish before then, steering too.




http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/crossmember/Img_0901.jpg
http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/crossmember/Img_0905.jpg
http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/crossmember/Img_0906.jpg
http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/crossmember/Img_0916.jpg
http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/crossmember/Img_0915.jpg
http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/crossmember/Img_0913.jpg
http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/crossmember/Img_0912.jpg

[paulkeith]

tube has started to bend.

almost $1grand of bling:
http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/tube/Img_0917.jpg

the first bends:
http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/tube/Img_0919.jpg
http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/tube/Img_0918.jpg

actually didn't mess them up....go figure

some engine hotness:

305 with TPI manifold, megasquirt custom fuel injection, cheapo ebay block hugger headers
http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/engine/Img_0923.jpg
http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/engine/Img_0920.jpg


some bling fittings to allow regular fuel line....(and crapass photo quality)
http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/engine/Img_0921.jpg

[ATL ZJ]

Looking good man, keep the pics flowin..

I feel ya on the bender, I took a hit buying my JD2... with the tube added in, it ended up being about $1300 and half a heart attack when i realized how much i spent, haha..

[Tommy]

That is a Pro Tools bender, right. That a nice bender, same one I got.

[paulkeith]

its a protools, with every option except the hydraulic. it also isn't mine..haha, but i dropped a nominal fee to my buddy for some bends. neither of us have bent tube before, but now that we got it mostly figured out, i've gotta help him with a cage for a IH scout after we finish this one.

anyway, the two hardest pieces of my cage are done, and perfect. haven't even scrapped any tube yet...fingers crossed. maybe that 4 years of engineering school is paying off....?

note that the third bend is compound in a plane 8* offset from the first two, allowing the cage to be the width of the 'sliders' until the 'b' pillar and then narrow down 'frame' width at the rear mount.


is it crinkled exhaust tube this time? dont think so bishes! 1.75 .120 DOM bling

sorry for the darkass pictures.
http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/tube/Img_0924.jpg
http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/tube/Img_0925.jpg

and after we finished the other, which was must faster since I only had to copy the one i already made....

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/tube/Img_0927.jpg
http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/tube/Img_0928.jpg
http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/tube/Img_0929.jpg
http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/tube/Img_0930.jpg


does it need more triangulation?? :finger:

[Kraqa]

uhh wide ass buggy batman. why do you need those sliders?

[paulkeith]

whole thing is 50" wide.

i finally ponied up the $130 and got myself a 90cu.ft. 25%co2/75%ar mix tank. yay for mig!

tube notcher was a $30 internet piece, and it works awesome.

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/tube/Img_0936.jpg
http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/tube/Img_0934.jpg
http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/tube/Img_0933.jpg

sorry for the quality. i typically work until its dark, and then my camera doesn't work well.

still have over 100' of tube left, probably 80 more to go into the cage putting me around 130ish feet total.

peace
Paul

[paulkeith]

no love.

2 more...progress is slowing down now that fitment for each piece takes 30-45 minutes...

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/tube/Img_0940.jpg
http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/tube/Img_0941.jpg

a little feedback?

[Kraqa]

haha i don't knwo why people arnt posting. i thinkits great.

i'd cleam the tube before you weld those. the cage looks much better now.

make and inverted V from the windsheils spreader to the bottom of the A pillar's (where they weld to the sliders)

What motor? what are he specs? Oh and show me that damn tube notcher for 30$

[ILikeMud]

Looks good man.
What kinda motor?

[Kraqa]

where's the updates???

[OverkillZJ]

This thing is so much sweeter than that "cage" you built years ago :finga:

[TrojanMan]

bump. more progress!

[paulkeith]

holy hell, i'm not sure how i stumbled over here. kraqa had a post on pbb that linked me to mallcrawlin, then i found this.

a little bit of update action:
http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/homestretch/Img_1057.jpg
http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/homestretch/Img_1054.jpg
http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/100_1444.jpg

apparently I have an issue with taking pictures at night.

anyway, the status:
got the hydraulic steering working on the 10 bolt just for proof of concept and to get it manueverable around the back yard. 305 was running OK on the megasquirt, still needed a lot of tuning on the laptop to get it running good. So it sat with an engine that needed massive tuning, a shitty 10bolt, blown front output bearing on the 205, trashed 3rd gear in the sm465..... from august of 06 until now, basically untouched. I went from full time student with no time to work on the buggy to a diploma-toting cubicle jockey with no time to work on the buggy.

I had a little cash, so this past weekend I got ambitious, drove to connecticut, and picked up this beauty:
http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/IMG_2126.jpg
and these beauties:
http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/IMG_2125.jpg

She's not much to look at, but she's pretty on the inside :D. TBI 350, sm 465, np205, 14bolt 4.10 gov locked (YESSS!!!) and a (...drum roll....fucking finally)... dana 60 w/ 4.10s. The tires are 39.5 16.50 boggers on allied 15x10 beadies.

I'm going to use pretty much everything, down to the wiring harness, as a direct transplant to the buggy.

So anyway, to be done on the buggy:

1) raise rocker "bars" up 4" and boatside, trash existing seat mounts.
2) recline b pillar for more comfortable seatback angle and legroom. remove windshield center bar and replace with /\.
3) finish up suspension mounts (shackle mounts, bushings up front, JJ's rear), relocate leaf mounts to extend wheelbase 5-6" and lower ride height 2-3"
4) build floor/firewall,
5) rework nose, narrow/lower to match radiator, stinger, front skid/winch mount
6) drop some more cash (when i have it..) on GLO diff covers and some other bling odds and ends. rear disc swap, etc etc.
7) full length flat belly from oilpan to back of seats

so now, the new stats should be:
109" WB on 39.5s, 23" clearance to belly skid (still kinda tall) and about 83" to the top.

Its a little to tall for two reasons.
-the leafs just make it that way. I could pony up for some alcan leaves that are flatter, but i'm not throwing money at it. when i link it, this will fix itself.
-i built the cage a little short and a little tall, but its too hard to change now. Affect on CG caused by a few extra inches of tube up top should be negligible.


hopeful super ambitious plan is to have it basically done around jan 5-6.

later
Paul

edit: man, i haven't been here in forever. I even get to change my sig line. I dont even own the m3 anymore..

[OverkillZJ]

Looks great!

[TrojanMan]

over a year later I still hate you.


all your truck are belong to us!

[paulkeith]

over a year later I still hate you.

muahahaha

[Duncanstives]

I need a raise :(

Oh wait... I JUST got one.

I need a bigger raise :(

LOL... Looks fucking sweet... Good job man... You do any sort of 3d modeling when designing this thing? Whats sort of drawings/documentation did you make?

[paulkeith]

I need a raise :(


dude, between taxes, rent, and bills i can't afford this either. loans man:D I'm about $4500 in including metal ($600) since may of 2005, and should be done around $5500 around march, realistically...that boils down to about $250 a month. I spend that on cable TV and beer...just to put it in perspective. Then some point down the road, triangulated 4 links, evo heims, and coilovers around, another 2.5-3k?? I need a raise too.

Yeah, I did some 3d CAD models. Between the engineering degree and plenty of time in cubicles, it just came naturally....Lots of drawings in margins and sketches and CAD 2d sketches too. My tools and the buggy are in SC, and I live in GA. This gives me basically all day every day to plan, and then a few weekends out of the year to actually weld on shit. As a result, I have a zillion drawings, and ideas pouring out of my eyes, and a lot of unfinished work in SC. What is finished, I want to change.

I tried a project in my younger years and completely fawked it up, so I sat back for about 3 years, read a lot, drew a lot, I stared loosely with some drawings of TJ and CJ frames, figured out what would be simple to make with the 2x4 I had...Some layouts for an easy to build yet fundamental cage...i shot for mostly straight tube, since that's what's the strongest. I measured my body, based the "cab" off of dimensions of me sitting in a seat, and also loosely based off the cab dimensions and windshield angles of a dodge ram. I'm a little unhappy with the lines of my chassis (as i mentioned before...too short/tall), but oh well...at least I didn't fire some check off in the mail and get my buggy shipped back to me. There's always next time. If I could do it again, it'd be lower and "faster" looking, but my design should at least be comfortable and provide excellent visiblity.

later,
Paul

[Duncanstives]

Loans...Nice... LOL.

I am an engineer as well but I am an electronics engineer... A lot of good THAT does me (though if I decide to put any industrial automation type stuff or digital radio modems or shit like that in my Jeep I will be in good shape! :D ). Sadly I WAS thinking of buying a directlogic 205 programable logic controller and a c-more touch panel and sticking THAT in there but common sense won out... I figured anything with a d35 rear and all that crap in it was nothing more than fluff.

Anyway... All that planning and stuff definitely helps... I am REALLY hoping to be able to model my entire ZJ unibody in Cosmos (part of Solidworks) so I can do different types of stress analysis on the mods I plan to do... But I can't find drawings of it anywhere :mad: :mad: .... We have Cosmos here at work and I know how to use it pretty well after having taken a 3rd year course in it... Also another guy (our ONE mechanical engineer) here who knows it even better has offered to help me out after work sometimes... Which would be awesome. You seem to know a lot about this stuff... Maybe you could stop by my thread sometime (when it gets a bit further a long perhaps) and see if you could offer some advice... I would be gretaful and hey... If you ever need any help with a 64 QAM radio on a chip you know who to ask :D

[Cody]

looks good man. Keep going. The most frustrating part is all the bug-working-outing which takes a lot of time and usualliy $$. In the end its a blast.
much better than what you did to that poor ZJ ;)

[paulkeith]

much better than what you did to that poor ZJ ;)

damn you cody! you were responsible for my painful introduction to pirate. oh well, i guess they sent me in the right direction at least...


Just a little update,

The following parts have arrived the da mail:

2x "Garage-Pro" mastercraft knockoffs, $297 to my door

2x RJS 5pt harnesses
a lot of tube tabs for removable tubes, seat belt tabs

2x summit greasable bushings for the front shackle mount

2x summit flex joints for the rear shackle mounts

2x GLO 14b spring perches

Ghetto Grizzly tube notcher...but used a buddy's for teh whole cage before and it worked pretty well. 59 bucks.

2x ballistic fab 3" wide leaf mounts, cuz i'm lazy.

also recently purchased:
4'x8' of .250
harbor freight bandsaw

all comes in $53 bucks over budget (for those parts) not bad. this puts me at about $5400.

Its up to me if I want to spend about another grand on wiring and plumbing this thing, or if I want to reuse most of the donor blazer stuff. TBD and probably won't be until mid to late spring.

The longer I look at what I've got, the more unhappy I get with my tube work. I've got a decent idea of where I want to go with it, but its going to be more rework than I initially expected. Here's what I'm shooting for now (don't mind my 4 minute ms paint sketch)

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/IMG_0942_1s.jpg

plus a ~8" extension in wheelbase, a 2-3" drop in ride height...

I took a few days off work and I'm heading to SC where the project lives on the 16th. I'll have until the 25th (minus family BS on thanksgiving..haha) to get as far as possible. I'm debating tearing down the blazer first or just spending the whole time bending and burning tube. The challenge will be to keep from getting burned out or getting lazy with the fab quality. Nov. and Dec. budgets are totally fawked, but that's what credit cards are for, right?

later,
Paul

[Kraqa]

chop down that roof line!!!!

JJ

looks good.

ALl the little BS will get to ya. i just got my ZJ tuned and then i chopped it.

[paulkeith]

chop down that roof line!!!!


yeah, she's a tall bitch, but its too much of an uphill battle to fix it.


i'll get it dead on next time :D

[Kraqa]

i ended up with a 46" roof line and a 8.5" belly. seams a bit tall but the drivline os down SOOOO low that it shoudl be just as stable with the narrowed axles as before.

[paulkeith]

i ended up with a 46" roof line and a 8.5" belly. seams a bit tall but the drivline os down SOOOO low that it shoudl be just as stable with the narrowed axles as before.

46 from floor to top of roof, and 8.5" from floor to bottom of belly?

[paulkeith]

sup fellers,

a little update.... I put 50-60 hours into the buggy over my thanksgiving break, and made almost no appreciable progress. I wasted a lot of time assembling my band saw, and mounting the bender, grinding, and cutting out old tube. Kind of a two steps backwards for every one step forward situation.

I cleaned up and relocated the rear leaf spring brackets to begin the lowering/wheelbase extension, and finished the johnny joint shackle mounts and build the shackles out of 3/8" flat bar, 7" eye to eye, bout 45* at ride height. Should make for decent droop.

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/nov2007/IMG_2184.jpg

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/nov2007/IMG_2186.jpg

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/nov2007/IMG_2187.jpg

sorry for the dark/shitty pics:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/nov2007/IMG_2189.jpg

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/nov2007/IMG_2196.jpg



Cut the B pillar X out to prepare to shorten it so i can recline it to match the seatback angle.

Also cut the rear stub-ass off to replace it with a larger ass. Got the one horizontal hoop bent up and two vertical supports, but no pics.

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/nov2007/IMG_2204.jpg

I was pretty frustrated with the week, got burned out from about 15 hours of running a grinder and a few grandparent health issues and didn't take many pics. Kind of bummed with the slow pace, but what can ya do. I'll have more progress around christmas time i guess.

later,
Paul

[paulkeith]

370 days later.....

got a little done over thanksgiving. hadn't even take the tarp off the old girl since last year.

killed a few days buying metal, wiring up the new plasma cutter, cutting/welding a set of end tables for my parents. ended up with really about 3.5 days of time to work.

new ass end, front tube chopped off in the foreground:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/nov2008/IMG_2915.jpg


the side fell off:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/nov2008/IMG_2916.jpg

rocker cleaned up, drilled for plug welds:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/nov2008/IMG_2917.jpg


new front tubework, rocker welded back on 4" higher: (fugly donor lurking in the background....she knows her days are numbered :D)

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/nov2008/IMG_2919.jpg

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/nov2008/IMG_2920.jpg

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/nov2008/IMG_2921.jpg

The higher rockers will give me more room to clock the case flat and get a flatter belly. It'll also make the floor muuuch easier.

On the to-do list for christmas (roughly 15 days):
-chop off and relocate front leaf mounts 3" forward and 3" higher (basically to match the rear), also 1/2" inboard on each side to match the perch width on the 60. Estimate final wheelbase at 108-112.
-finish off the front of the frame rails, bumper/front shackle mounts, maybe a 6' rock boner
-pull out the mockup 305/465/205/14b/10b
-tear down blazer and swap in tons, 350/465/205
-floor/firewall, put the B pillar X-brace back in (cut out to raise rockers and recline slightly)
-another ~40 feet of tube gussets/tie-ins

Pie in the sky is to have it ready to bring to atlanta in Jan. so I can do piecemeal work on plumbing brakes, fuel, steering / wiring / finishing touches. If time has taught me anything, its that I'll get half that list done and it'll take twice as long....but hey, a guy can dream.

holler.

[paulkeith]

well, i'll just keep talking to myself then.

made some progress over break. ended up kind of relaxing with the family, also came down with a fever and kind of just chilled in the house which killed another 2 days. long story short, i only got items 1 and 2 on the above list. go figure.

anyway, here are some pics of what I got done:

new leaf mounts, pre- lasercut, all i did was weld them together.

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/dec2008/IMG_2925.jpg

reasons south carolina doesn't suck: 70 degrees and sunny on christmas eve

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/dec2008/IMG_2926.jpg

next day, weather hit the fan. 40 and rainy...haha

onward. trimming frame rails to length:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/dec2008/IMG_2927.jpg

.250" C-Channel front bumper/crossmember tacked in

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/dec2008/IMG_2931.jpg

template of my fish plates:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/dec2008/IMG_2932.jpg

from cardboard to .250" plate:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/dec2008/IMG_2933.jpg

used mah bandsaw to cut about 3/4 of the way through, then beat em to 90* with a vice and sledge:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/dec2008/IMG_2936.jpg

bend relief cuts welded up:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/dec2008/IMG_2941.jpg

shackle mounts in the making, 3/8" flat bar, summit machine poly pushings:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/dec2008/IMG_2937.jpg

after a hot date with the plasma, grinder, and flap:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/dec2008/IMG_2938.jpg

test fit onto the fish plates:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/dec2008/IMG_2939.jpg

front xmember welded in:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/dec2008/IMG_2940.jpg

fish plates tacked on:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/dec2008/IMG_2942.jpg

ain't neer comin off:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/dec2008/IMG_2944.jpg

shackle mounts welded on:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/dec2008/IMG_2945.jpg

hammered rusto:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/dec2008/IMG_2946.jpg

leafs reinstalled, liberal application of grade 8 all around:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/dec2008/IMG_2947.jpg

holding weight:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/dec2008/IMG_2949.jpg

poser flex...nothing too spectacular here. the driver's rear ran out of compression room too early because of my crazy spring plates with incorporated shock mounts. also think the real 40s plus beadlocks should weigh a little more and keep the front planted a little longer. also lengthened the front shackles since that picture since (you can see it barely) the passenger shackle was inverting. went from 5" to 7", think i'll settle somewhere around 6.

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/dec2008/IMG_2950.jpg

she's finally starting to take shape, look a little proportional:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/dec2008/IMG_2953.jpg


true.

[zj95]

gawd thats a tall roofline...

[paulkeith]

yeh, the rest of the thread covers that ad nauseum. too much trouble to fix it now.

[redline61]

Who cares, the ground will be farther from your head when you roll it. Looking good.

[IndyZJ]

Are those shackle bushings the not the same width as the spring bushings, or is that just the camera? You're probably gonna want to carry spare front springs with you with those shackles being so far out there. Have you thought about springs with an offset center pin, like waggys fronts, XJs or toyota rears? I'd just be worried about ramming the shackles into everything and bending/ breaking springs. With the waggy springs and 40s you'd have much better approach angle.

[paulkeith]

you're right, the bushings are 2 5/8" and the leaf bushings are 3". shackles joggle 3/16" per side.

i dont like the front setup either. It will get a little better with the 40s on there instead of those 35" rollers on there now, and i also want to drill the perches to try to cheat the axle forward about 1" too. Hopefully that'll get the tires up past the shackles, but i dont think it will. If these start breaking, I will definitely move to an offset pin spring (considered the waggys like you mentioned), but more than likely if i have reliability issues i'm just going to link it.

paul

[IndyZJ]

You're gonna want to look into some offset shackles then, as they'll probably bind like crazy like that. Ruff Stuff has 1/8" and 1/4" side plates pretty cheap, but I didn't see any 3/16". If you really wanted to you could always try to re-drill your center pin hole, but you'd be looking at a good drill bit or two and about half an hour per spring, lol.

[paulkeith]

i've heard if you redrill spring holes, the main leaf almost ALWAYS cracks at the old hole.


not sure i follow you on the shackles. the centerline of the spring and the centerline of the bushing are aligned, and each side plate is joggled inward (offset) 3/16" to make 3/8" of total width reduction. the shackles in those pictures were just mockup, the ones currently on there are longer/beefier, didn't snap any pics though.

[IndyZJ]

Older high-mileage springs will crack a lot of the time after being redrilled, but I've seen people have good luck with newer ones. I personally wouldn't do it though.

With the shackles like that, they'll be putting an uneven load on the bushings and bolts. You could probably get away with it, but it'll try to eat bushings/ snap bolts at the shackles and not allow the suspension to move freely. At least that's what happened with a buddy's CJ with YJ springs on the front(1/2" wider) with the original hangers. You could just put a 3/16 washer on each side of the hangers to take care of it.

[paulkeith]

thought about the washer, but i just bent the shackles. i essentially built an offset into the shackles like the ruffstuff ones you mentioned. the surfaces where it meets either bushing is flat to the bushing face and perpendicular to the bolt, but the frame end is offset inward 3/16". make sense or am i misunderstanding you?

[IndyZJ]

Yup that works. As long as the shackles are flat where they contact the bushings you'll be good to go.

[TrojanMan]

Those gloves remind me of the time we had to shave poly off of the rear pucks on my BB :D

Looks like they might not do as good of a job this time:finga:

[Kraqa]

new we rock rules need 6" from the top of your helmut.

this will be the only buggy that currently meets that!!!!

[paulkeith]

new we rock rules need 6" from the top of your helmut.

this will be the only buggy that currently meets that!!!!

see? for years people laughed. turns out i was just a visionary! bitches! :flipoff2:


yeah, those gloves are pretty tired. picked up a new set for cleaner work just a few days ago.

[paulkeith]

weather was nice so i fueled up and made a quick run to SC. put in maybe 15-20 hours over 3 days.

just getting into the swing of things when the welder starting being a bitch. I was having feed speed issues with the hose/cable in anything but a straight line away from the welder. got pretty pissed off, disassembled the hose...took the liner out. Once i pulled the wire out of the liner, i couldn't get it back through again. there was some kind of blockage in there. Eventually cut the liner at the blockage with cutters...the blockage was compacted metal shavings and dust. Weird. Anyway, new liner is on order and the rest of the weekend I was without a welder. Just meant I had to notch better...:D

Cut out the old B pillars and reclined them, made a new b pillar "X", added a whole bunch of other tube:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/feb2009/IMG_2969.jpg

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/feb2009/IMG_2977.jpg

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/feb2009/IMG_2978.jpg

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/feb2009/IMG_2979.jpg

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/feb2009/IMG_2981.jpg



buggy in a pile....just add a welder:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/feb2009/IMG_2984.jpg

edit, also realizing my 'garage pro' jcwhitney seats are probably going to have to hit the scrap pile or craigslist for midgets. They are looking like they are much shorter than they should be...top the headrest is roughly the top of my neck. Not good, and i'm only 5'9"


progression since november:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/IMG_2184.jpg

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/IMG_2915.jpg

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/IMG_2981.jpg

[Kirsch98ZJ]

That looks a lot better now. I think once you get it all finished up its going to look great. I might have missed it, but what are your plans for tires?

[ATL ZJ]

wow! It looks infinity times better. I really like the lines of the cage in the rear. I'm impressed with your patience to redesign with so much else left to do, but you'll be glad you took the time. Any plans for a door bar?

[paulkeith]

thanks for the compliments. Its been a long road, motivating to finally see some lines coming together.

Kirsch, tires will be 39.5 boggers on 15x10 locks. Probably going to cut them for a little better sidehill traction, not 100% on that yet. There's a pic of them back somewhere in the thread.

Cam,

Yeah...I have plans for a door bar. Just don't want to put them in yet as I've still got a lot of climbing in/out to do. Plans are something along this paint sketch....

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/IMG_29535.jpg

thoughts?

Also, its 80.5" to the top, 21" to teh skid. Add ~2" for the final tire size, subtract a little for additional tube weight, fuel, etc. Tall, but not as bad as i was initially expecting.

Paul

[ELLLLLIOTTTTT]

Updates?

[paulkeith]

Stay tuned. Few weeks over christmas should yield some results. Tarp hasn't come off the thing since Feb....

[ATL ZJ]

Stay tuned. Few weeks over christmas should yield some results. Tarp hasn't come off the thing since Feb....

You mean the boggers haven't sold yet?!

[paulkeith]

Nope. I thought $750 for a set of boggers on locks would go like fire. Lukewarm interest at best.

I'd like to see all the tubes pictured above tacked in, the blazer torn down, and the 14b/60 under the chassis. Not really a lot of complex work, just a lot of heavy stuff to be disassembled/moved/reassembled.

reedit: just read back over this whole "build." amazing how 4 years boils down to 4 or 5 fab sessions. fail.

[Jeeptech01]

That is awesome! Frame, cage, beefy axles, iorn t case, and a v-8. All you need now is a chick to blow you while you drive... Maybe a mullet too? That might be pushing it LOL.

Seriously keep at it. That thing will be sick when its done!

[CrawlerReady]

Never saw this build...but I like it!

Good work Paul! Keep it up man!

[paulkeith]

question for those of you who have fabbed engine mounts:

This is my current design*:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/current.jpg

*naming convention stolen from cam

The motor mount is a few inch long arm that reaches to the frame.

The more i think about this, the less I like it. That's putting a huge moment arm on the bolts holding the mount to the block.

I want to do this:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/proposed.jpg

Because I think it would be stronger and friendlier to the bolts screwed into the block.

The only downside I can see to revising the design is that the new arms hard mounted to the frame might get in the way when pulling the motor out.

Any other thoughts or considerations?

[Jeeptech01]

That is how most of the swap kits do it. Hell thats how most oem's do it. If you use a block mount that pushes the through bolt away from the block you'll be golden.

[paulkeith]

That is how most of the swap kits do it. Hell thats how most oem's do it. If you use a block mount that pushes the through bolt away from the block you'll be golden.

What? My point was keeping the bolt closer to the block as that's what would reduce the moment.

[IndyZJ]

Even if it's a bit harder to put the motor in, which still wouldn't be a big deal, it's a hell of a lot better than pulling the threads out or cracking the block.

[ATL ZJ]

I like the diagram. My motor is mounted both ways... the first style on the passenger side and the second style on the driver side. I did it that way because of the way the passenger side is set back farther on the LS style motors and I had a much tighter clearance with the header on that side. I know you have seen my dark crappy pics, but here they are again for illustrative purposes.

Passenger
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v125/atlzj/IMG_0300.jpg

Driver
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v125/atlzj/IMG_0298.jpg

Honestly I wouldn't worry too much about the larger moment. I did tie into a 5th threaded boss on the motor on the passenger side to help compensate for the additional leverage, but even without it, I think my mounts would be on par with what most guys are running in tube chassis rigs. The main thing is getting into the habit of checking torque on important fasteners like these periodically.

Both styles can be made to work, so just build whichever fits your rig better, is quicker to build, and gets you closer to wheeling that thing one day. layer up- working outside this time of year sucks.

[Jeeptech01]

I meant for your concern of getting the motor in and out. Like the oem style clamshell block mount. Or a set of moroso engine mounts make for solid frame pads. Then just use your round bushing on the end of your frame stands. Sorry if I wasnt clear.

[paulkeith]

No worries mate. I've already got the mounts built as pictured in the top picture. The frame end mount is only the holes.

[Jeeptech01]

10-4 Cant wait to see this thing on the trails!

[Kraqa]

what ever you do tie the motor mount togetherunder the block.

i have mounted my motor both ways and i found the bushing at the frame lasts longer due to motor block temps.

i've seen that bushing oozing out of the casing when i was racing.

[paulkeith]

nice. i had settled on that myself; bushing at the frame for disassembly ease, strengthened by connecting the sides.

thanks for the tip!

pics + update pending in a few days...

[Jeeptech01]

:smt069Bring on the pics :smt114

[paulkeith]

barely got anything done. argh!

all work done was tearing the blazer apart. remainder of the time was spent fitting the bullbar on the 5.9, bleeding the brakes on the 5.9, chasing the MIL on the 5.9, and welding some d-rings onto my dad's trailer for him. oh, and some family christmas bullshit somewhere inbetween.....:D

all went well until the last minute of yesterday when i was setting the engine down to tarp it up and store it. engine hoist was in soft dirt (ton of rain lately) and over it went....engine landed on its side, bent the d-side header and snapped the slave cylinder mount off the bellhousing. Fawk.

anyway, i snapped a few pics of the blazer teardown, but no cool progress pics. pretty frustrating.

first pics start on the 2nd day of the teardown, top and front clip off:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/dec2009/IMG_3210Large.jpg

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/dec2009/IMG_3211Large.jpg

front clip:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/dec2009/IMG_3213Large.jpg

interior stripped down to get harness + ECU out:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/dec2009/IMG_3212Large.jpg

took all the body mounts loose, wrapped a tow strap around the body and drove the other way with our john deere tractor, off the body went:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/dec2009/IMG_3214Large.jpg

pulling engine:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/dec2009/IMG_3215Large.jpg

bare frame:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/dec2009/IMG_3217Large.jpg

pulling axles out from under:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/dec2009/IMG_3218Large.jpg

beginning of plasma destruction:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/dec2009/IMG_3219Large.jpg

finito:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/dec2009/IMG_3221Large.jpg

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/dec2009/IMG_3226Large.jpg

and left behind, we finally have:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/dec2009/IMG_3225Large.jpg

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/dec2009/IMG_3224Large.jpg

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/dec2009/IMG_3222Large.jpg

another day's work of loading the shit on the trailer, and we have:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/dec2009/IMG_3227Large.jpg

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/dec2009/IMG_3228Large.jpg

took it to our local recycling yard. 2,300lbs. Got $94.40 for it.


one of my christmas presents a few days early:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/dec2009/IMG_3220Large.jpg

that's all i got. hopefully i can get a weekend or two to make it back to SC and get some work done. only need another 2-3 days and i can have everything under the chassis for the first time ever. then it'll FINALLY, after 4 years, turn into noticeable and satisfying forward progress.

later,
paul

[ATL ZJ]

You are the posterchild of delayed gratification.

Keep it up! it's impossible to not be inspired by your patience.

[Jeeptech01]

You are the posterchild of delayed gratification.

Keep it up! it's impossible to not be inspired by your patience.

WOW!! Bookmarking for future use!!

Hang in there Paul. All the bs just makes forward progress all the more satisfying.

[paulkeith]

so for funsies I did a little tallying.

I've worked on my buggy on the following dates:

May 21 - May 30 2005

May 23 - August 10 2006

Nov 18 - Nov 24 2007

Nov 26 - Nov 29 2008

Dec 24 - Dec 29 2008

Feb 6 - Feb 9 2009

Dec 2009 was blazer teardown, so not real work on the buggy but,

Dec 22 - Dec 28 2009

That equals a little over 3.5 months of total work days. Since may 2005.

Fawk. Me. :mad:

[Jeeptech01]

Are you trying to give yourself a pep talk? Its better than nothing I guess.

[paulkeith]

.....no? motivation isn't exactly the impeding factor in me making progress.

just thought it was interesting how little time it adds up to.

[Jeeptech01]

Yea I know what you mean. I've been building the Buick for 4 1/2 years now. At least its almost done. But if I had the time and money I prolly could have finished it in like 3 months at the same level of quality.

Kinda makes me wish I was born rich instead of good lookin.

[paulkeith]

Orders placed:

Ballistic Fab: Various tabs, trick tabs, mini trick tabs

McMaster: socket cap button head and standard head, weld nuts, tap

Heleta: Cutoff x10, flap x10, grind x2, sand discs x3 (gonna try em)

weldingsupply.com: .030 wire and tips, recessed nozzle

Mid-Carolina Steel: 3x 1.75 .120 DOM, 4'x8' 18ga, 4'x8' 14ga

Vacation approved Mar 1-5.

Turns out going wheelin in someone else's junk is awesome motivation.

Let's see what I can get done.:rock:

[OverkillZJ]

Haha, GSSE-W lit a fire under your ass, didn't it?

[Pearce]

Orders placed:

Ballistic Fab: Various tabs, trick tabs, mini trick tabs



Dont be surprised if that order shows up 4 weeks late. I see you took vacation time for building so I'd keep track of that one. And I think the tradition is set that you get to test run it at one of the GSSE's. :D

[ATL ZJ]

Haha good thing you didn't stay through Sunday or you probably would have bought the LS1 off Kirby's trailer too :smt037

[paulkeith]

Dont be surprised if that order shows up 4 weeks late. I see you took vacation time for building so I'd keep track of that one.

yeah, i'd read a lot about their inability to anything in a timely fashion lately. bummer for them. they're some of the simpler parts so maybe/hopefully they're on the shelf and will go out within a reasonable timeframe.

luckily the parts in that order are not mission critical at this point. the things that are are the steel and welding supplies....and the welding supplies already got delivered and the steel will be ready for pickup tomorrow....about 4 days before I can get to SC anyway.

i think i'm low on shielding gas, but i'll have to check that out when i'm there. funny how the simple things get complex when you're trying to do logistics on a build 260 miles away.

[ELLLLLIOTTTTT]

I guess you're going to pull a real Cam with this build huh?

I smell a new reality show. Build a fully functional rock crawler in less than a month. Good luck!

[ATL ZJ]

I guess you're going to pull a real Cam with this build huh?

I smell a new reality show. Build a fully functional rock crawler in less than a month. Good luck!

I'm not sure what that means but I think I watched it happen on monster garage several years ago.

[SirFuego]

Turns out going wheelin in someone else's junk is awesome motivation.
In so many words, I heard this same thing about 20 times this past weekend from Overkill :D

Good luck with the build.

[paulkeith]

I guess you're going to pull a real Cam with this build huh?

I smell a new reality show. Build a fully functional rock crawler in less than a month. Good luck!

fully functional? hardly. I would like to knock out most of the 'macro' fab though.

In all reality GSSE-W '11 would still be an absurdly tight deadline for what I've got to do and when I'll have time/funds to do it. GSSE '11 is probably more like it.

Paul

[zjeepin]

fully functional? hardly. I would like to knock out most of the 'macro' fab though.

In all reality GSSE-W '11 would still be an absurdly tight deadline for what I've got to do and when I'll have time/funds to do it. GSSE '11 is probably more like it.

Paul

haha, well good luck with the build man. looking forward to seeing your progress on this thing

[Cue-Ball]

Yea I know what you mean. I've been building the Buick for 4 1/2 years now. At least its almost done. But if I had the time and money I prolly could have finished it in like 3 months at the same level of quality.

Kinda makes me wish I was born rich instead of good lookin.

I hear ya there, lack of time and money makes for a VERY VERY slow build project.

[Jeeptech01]

lol I forgot I posted that. Yea and a new and cheaper project is waiting in the wings.

[paulkeith]

just got a UPS ship notification for my ballistic order. 2 days from order placement to shipped. not as good as McMaster's 25 minutes, but nothing to get stirred up over by any means.

My head is going a mile a minute over this upcoming week. Very excited.

[Jeeptech01]

Better take pics!

[ATL ZJ]

My head is going a mile a minute over this upcoming week. Very excited.

at least you have some recent practice at building under deadlines ;)

[paulkeith]

Better take pics!

i'll see if i can remember my memory card this time.

[Jeeptech01]

Cool. Have you made a to do list?

[paulkeith]

I have.

-adjust some tubework to facilitate skinning of wheelwells/firewall
-finish base where b pillar X will land
-tack in all new already prepared tubing
-mount seats
-clock 205
-rebuild crossmember
-build floor frame + floor skins
-frame/prepare for skid
-close rocker tubes to frame
-skin 'boat sides'
-mount pedals + orbital
-firewall
-tranny tunnel
-dash
-floor out rear chassis under fuel cell and storage area

as far as i make it on the list will be good enough for me. gotta remember to have fun.

I'm planning on bringing the axles with me back to ATL to strip/teardown/rebuild/reassemble/prime/paint, etc.

Should get another 7 days or so around Jul 4 to knock out some more work.

:smt036

[ATL ZJ]

Wow, that's pretty ambitious for a single week.

Here is some free advice you did not ask for and might not want. :smt037 Bring everything you possibly can back to ATL to work on, once it's laid out, sized, or ready for detail work. Doing that in the past has really has helped me separate myself from the urgency of the stale build environment and take my time on stuff. And for your situation it means you could get more work done in your "off time" and be in a better frame of mind at the beginning of your next fab trip, feeling like you've already accomplished something.

you might have told me, but are the axles already geared and locked? Hope you have a nice 1950s craft shed outbuilding to work on your axles in, I hear that's ideal.

[paulkeith]

It is ambitious, but there are a few items on the list that might sound deceptively time consuming. The first 3 items I can probably knock out before lunch on day 1. The 2 tubes that need to be moved aren't even tacked in, so it'll take some flap work, the X pillar base is all cut and bent, just needs to be welded in (actually already has 1 weld on it, which is right when the welder broke on the trip back in feb), and tacking the rest of the tubing is just a matter of holding it up and tacking it in. i'm planning that a lion's share of the time will be spend in framing and skinning the floor, pedals, and firewall, 3-4 days. If I come away with the tubes in that pile higher up in the thread tacked in, the seats mounted, a floor, and the pedals hung, I will be happy.

I've tossed the idea of also maybe maybe bringing the whole motor/tranny/tcase to do once overs, check them out, rebuild/replace as necessary, strip and paint. TBD on if i feel like kicking the zj out of the garage until july.

The axles are 4.10s, open front, govlock rear. 4.10s really won't be adequate with 6.55:1/1.96:1, so I think I might just leave them alone until I can afford to regear them to 5.38 and toss in some real traction aids. Won't be hitting the dirt til at least early/mid '11 so maybe by then I'll have some mo dolla dolla billlzzz....?

[Jeeptech01]

Sweet. Hit it hard early and then relax toward the end of the week. One thing I have been doing recently with success is if something is pissing me off or just not going the way I want I just start on something else and go back to it. Sounds simple I know but it really hard to do well... if you are ocd like me.

[ATL ZJ]

Sweet. Hit it hard early and then relax toward the end of the week. One thing I have been doing recently with success is if something is pissing me off or just not going the way I want I just start on something else and go back to it. Sounds simple I know but it really hard to do well... if you are ocd like me.

that is great advice... Even knocking out some small meaningless tasks will restore your calmness enough to go back to it level-headed. If I hadn't learned this strategy a while ago, I would have kept messing with my nonfunctional clutch instead of moving on, and would not have made GSSE-W. but I knew I needed to give it a rest and finish something else first.

[paulkeith]

-adjust some tubework to facilitate skinning of wheelwells/firewall - DONE
-finish base where b pillar X will land - DONE
-tack in all new already prepared tubing - DONE
-mount seats
-clock 205 - DONE
-rebuild crossmember - DONE
-build floor frame + floor skins
-frame/prepare for skid
-close rocker tubes to frame
-skin 'boat sides'
-mount pedals + orbital
-firewall
-tranny tunnel
-dash
-floor out rear chassis under fuel cell and storage area


So, in true me fashion, got very little done, but I'm pretty happy with the work I did this week so I guess its not all lost. As usual, burned a lot of time grinding off old mistakes, etc.

Had to fix my welder cart, it folded:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0011Medium.jpg

All my purchases laid out:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0010Medium.jpg

Sure doesn't look like $550:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0014Medium.jpg

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0015Medium.jpg

Clocking the 205:

Ring:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0013Medium.jpg

Work area:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0020Medium.jpg

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0022Medium.jpg

Trim template:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0023Medium.jpg

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0024Medium.jpg

Cut and test fit:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0025Medium.jpg

Buttoned up, gotta come apart again to RTV and upgrade the studs/nuts:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0026Medium.jpg

Nosed the heap into the door to pull the old mill:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0029Medium.jpg

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0030Medium.jpg

New(old) meets old (older):

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0034Medium.jpg

New braced and gusseted motor mount/crossmember thing:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0035Medium.jpg

Goin in:


http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0036Medium.jpg

New engine mount in action, you can see the gussets I put in on the frame side of the mounts as well:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0039Medium.jpg

Now, on to the crossmember. This thing took literally 3 days to build and pretty much soaked up the whole week. Maybe I work slow, but easily the most complex thing I’ve ever built. Whatever. On to the pics:

Start with two 0.250” plates, 11”x4”:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0037Medium.jpg
Drilled, mocked in place with 1.750” tube sleeves
http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0038Medium.jpg

Skip a bit, bolted up and one leg done:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0042Medium.jpg

[paulkeith]

My nighttime working conditions:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0041Medium.jpg

Bit of detail on the next leg…pipemaster used to mock fitup:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0043Medium.jpg

Plasma:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0044Medium.jpg

+Flap:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0046Medium.jpg

Bushing assembly:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0048Medium.jpg

In:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0050Medium.jpg

Next two legs mocked up and tacked in. 110* bends. Tighter radius would have worked wonders, but I’ll make due:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0051Medium.jpg

I dub thee ‘Crossmemberus Maximus’:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0052Medium.jpg

Welded, in patterns to avoid warping. Warped anyway, huge bitch to re-install….:(:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0053Medium.jpg

Painted:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0054Medium.jpg

In for good:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0055Medium.jpg

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0057Medium.jpg

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0056Medium.jpg

Waste for the week, not bad:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0058Medium.jpg

At this point I stopped taking pics, and tacked a lot of the already prepared tubing in place. Cleaned up most of Friday night and snapped these this morning before the tarp went on. Not really much in the way of notable visible progress, but like I said, I’m pretty happy with the quality of work I did this week.

I also bent new tubes for the front, slightly shallower angle. I like it better.

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0059Medium.jpg

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0060Medium.jpg

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0061Medium.jpg


The 60 and 14 are in the bed of my truck in the parking lot. I'm fawking spent from working on it this week and haven't unloaded them yet, but should trickle some progress from polishing those up over the next few weeks.

Cheers.

Paul

[Jeeptech01]

Good work. I see what you mean about the tighter radius. But hell its a buggy. Oh yea, if I had a dollar for everything that was "in for good" that wasnt I'd be a rich sombitch. Instead Im just a sombitch LOL.

[ATL ZJ]

Looks good man... that new camera works a lot better with a memory card. ;) That's some decent progress. That crossmember is nuts... you sure the 205 shifters are going to clear it?

Having the axles in ATL to work on should ease any concern of not getting as much done as you might have wanted. But if you still need further motivation, I think I have a seat open again in a couple weeks :D

[paulkeith]

Stupid memory card. Camera did work OK, but still disappointed in its low-light performance. The old p&s wasn't any better, so maybe I'm just spoiled by my dslr. Daytime it works great though.

I'm going to have to get creative with the shifters. I'm going to twin stick it and run cable shifters which will help a little, but I figured I could work something out. I'm also going to tie the 205 side mount into the crossmember somehow as well. As it sits its just two bolts 7" apart, which isn't much fighting what will be a pretty decent amount of torque after the reduction(s).

Yeah, the axles are still in the truck. Not looking forward to digging them out. Gotta straighten up the garage to make some room too. Meh.

[ATL ZJ]

cool. you are welcome to borrow my cherry picker if it would make moving the axles easier.

[Jeeptech01]

Why'd you ditch the tune port motor?

[paulkeith]

its a 305, and on megasquirt. I suppose I could swap the intake over to the 350 and get a correct ecu, but I have everything to make the TBI turnkey so I went with it.

[slim616]

i give it to you, "slow in steady won the race" most people would of ditched it and went to something else (me included)

glad to see your pushing through and looking forward to seeing your finished rig.

[Jeeptech01]

its a 305, and on megasquirt. I suppose I could swap the intake over to the 350 and get a correct ecu, but I have everything to make the TBI turnkey so I went with it.

Makes sense.

[paulkeith]

unloaded the axles tonight. took me like an hour, surprisingly easy going at it solo.

as it came:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0062Medium.jpg

60:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0063Medium.jpg

14:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0064Medium.jpg

stacked up, ready to take a grinder beating:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0067Medium.jpg

some of those handy caster-bottom jackstand things they built on trucks! would sure come in handy right about now. maybe I should buy a basic 110 fluxcore so i can stick pieces of metal together for stuff like that.

clearance with the 5.9 just inside the door:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0070Medium.jpg

and, man...look at all these scratches on my shiny street queen ARB.......almost like someone leaned something against my bullbar at windrock or something..........:D:flipoff2:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0072Medium.jpg

[ATL ZJ]

and, man...look at all these scratches on my shiny street queen ARB.......almost like someone leaned something against my bullbar at windrock or something..........:D:flipoff2:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0072Medium.jpg

now what kind of asshole would abuse your mall bling with his hilift? while you were feeding him beer no less?

tell you what, to make it right i'll arrange for you to use his welder to pimp your jackstands ;)

[paulkeith]

ahh its all good. had to happen sometime. at least it was a hi-lift, and not a parking barrier at the mall :D

might take you up on that welder offer. i *can* move it as it is, but it is not what i'd call easy. would be nice to have to have it on wheels to position it with room to work when the jeep is out.

[Jeeptech01]

Is it just the pic or is there some serious rust pitting on the 14b tube near the driver side leaf mount?

[paulkeith]

Good eye. The 14 bolt tubes are a disaster. I can't believe the amount of material missing. This thing did come from CT, but holy crap. It looks more like an old set of perches was cut off by a fawking idiot than rust alone.

I'll post up some pictures when I get to the 14 and clean it up, see what you guys think. I dont know that I'd say the 14 bolt tubes are exactly a weak spot, but 14s are cheap enough that maybe its a bad idea to hang on to it. It's also gov locked which means I need a new carrier to detroit it, so its quickly stacking up like I should just get rid of this thing. I guess I do have another one sitting under the buggy anyway, but I'd have to re-gear it. Which i had to do anyway. head....hurting....

I would say the max gouge depth is as much as 0.250 in some places. Thoughts?

[Jeeptech01]

Me thinks finding another would be better. Rather than polishing a turd. Shit .250 is the thickness of some/most axletubes.

[paulkeith]

14s are 1/2" but even then 50% thickness loss would be miles past unacceptable. I may be overstating the .250. Let me get started on the 14 instead of the 60 tonight and see what I'm working with.

I left my damn spindle nut socket in SC. Cam, you got one?

[paulkeith]

in a stroke of genius, i brought 1 (slightly worn) cutoff wheel from SC, so i basically nibbled at 1 of 2 perches before it was down to a nub.

moved on and wirewheeled the gouged areas:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0073Medium.jpg

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0081Medium.jpg

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0079Medium.jpg

Max gouge depth is right at 3/16".

WTF could have done this? It allllmost looks like some sort of integral u-bolt locating feature with how uniform the outermost lips are, but there's no way...never seen/heard/read anything of that sort. Loose u-bolts? Salt? I've never seen axle tubes look like this.

So what say ye? I'm leaning towards scrap pile....:smt102

[IndyZJ]

Holy shit that is bad. I've seen a few like that around here. My best guess is that it's from salt getting between the u bolts and axle, then just sitting there and collecting moisture . The rest of the vehicle is usually pretty neglected, so it makes sense that it wouldn't ever have been washed out/ fixed when it was still minor.

My .02: It might be ok, but you're building it from the ground up - do it with parts you are confident in so you aren't always worrying about an axle tacoing itself if it doesn't happen anyway. Like you said, 14 bolts are cheap. At least you got a spare set of shafts and hubs, and if you wanted to cut the housing and shave the ring gear, you can use that housing for the grinding. Or consider it the start of a 14 bolt front end :D

[rstrucks]

Wow, that is some serious pitting. I'd say find yourself a new axle.

[zj95maxx]

If you can find an axle easily, do it.

if not, I wouldn't worry about it too much honestly..

truss the axle and run some supports to that area and be done with it.


people worry too much.:smt067

[paulkeith]

If I were linking it, I'd truss the shit out of it and never think about it again.

Given that I'm going leafs at least for a little while, the weight load the axle bears will be right smack in the middle of the gouges. This is what concerned me.

I have another 14bolt, and its sitting under the buggy right now. The internals aren't in quite as good a shape. Its 3.73 open, but that means I have the 4 pin carrier and can drop a detroit in. The axle above is govlocked and would've required a new carrier anyway.

Means I have to re-gear the other axle to 4.10 to match the 60, or bite the real bullet and go 5.38s.....but I'm quick running out of $$$.

Ugh.

[ATL ZJ]

I'd replace it man... not worth the $80 in savings to have to constantly worry about. Pullapart usually has at least a few 14 bolts in their South ATL yard. At least now you have some spare shafts...

edit: solution: go to pullapart, grab 4 bolt 4.10 carrier and pinion, weld carrier. that would save you about $1k over going 5.38s and buying a detroit right?

[paulkeith]

Easily. Then again, what's keeping me from pulling the 4.10s out of that axle, putting them into the axle under the buggy, and welding up the govlock?

I'd then have a 3.73 gearset to sell, an open carrier to hang on to to eventually detroit, and spare hubs/shafts from the above axle, and a few bucks of recycled steel from that housing.

[ATL ZJ]

welding up the govlock?


Isn't welding a govlock supposed to be weaker than a non govlock carrier? Haven't done it personally but have been told there are some differences...

[paulkeith]

Yeah, doing a little reading on it. Consensus seems to be to just forget it.

[paulkeith]

Ooook. I think I'm going to take the 4.10s, stuff them into the other axle on the open carrier, and sell the 3.73s and gov lock, and maybe net a case of brew.

Now, do I 'ruin' the open carrier I've got by welding it, necessitating that I buy another open carrier at some point down the road to detroit it, or bite the bullet now and get a detroit?

Input from guys with welded rears...? Worth the extra $350 now ($detroit - $future purchase of open carrier) for the performance of a detroit? Does the welded rear push you off lines enough to annoy you? Are you annoyed enough to not miss $350?

[zj95maxx]

Detroits are closer to the 400 dollar mark. At least they were when I purchased one.

I love the Detroit, but I have never had a welded diff so I can't really compare the two.

[ATL ZJ]

Just weld the spiders into a ball of steel rather than welding the spiders to the windows of the carrier. That way you can remove the spool later to install a detroit if you want.

My spool is really annoying sometimes and does push me off lines. It would be a lot more bearable with 50 degrees of front steering or rear steer, but I don't have those luxuries. The bad thing about detroits is they often get taken out when shafts break... so about the only thing the spool gives me is peace of mind.

[paulkeith]

Detroits are closer to the 400 dollar mark. At least they were when I purchased one.

I love the Detroit, but I have never had a welded diff so I can't really compare the two.

They are, my point was that it will "cost" me another open carrier to install a detoit if i were to weld up my current carrier.


Just weld the spiders into a ball of steel rather than welding the spiders to the windows of the carrier. That way you can remove the spool later to install a detroit if you want.

My spool is really annoying sometimes and does push me off lines. It would be a lot more bearable with 50 degrees of front steering or rear steer, but I don't have those luxuries. The bad thing about detroits is they often get taken out when shafts break... so about the only thing the spool gives me is peace of mind.

Hmm. I would say something like, "when was the last time you saw a 14b shaft go?", but it was like 3 weeks ago. :smt108

So you're saying fill up the spider gears but don't weld them to the side gears or to the case?

[ATL ZJ]

So you're saying fill up the spider gears but don't weld them to the side gears or to the case?

Yeah, use half of the split carrier and gravity to keep the spiders and side gears aligned while you tack them. Then flip it and tack the other side. Then melt 6 lbs of wire and a bunch of old bolts into it...

[paulkeith]

True, I guess as long as you don't weld either the side gears or spiders to the case, the detroit replaces it all. Keep forgetting the 14bolt carrier splits in half. Hmm.

So...the question remains...looking back at when you built your 14, would it have been worth it at the time to drop a detroit in and be done with it?

[AgitatedPancake]

yeah man we just welded up a ford 9" a few months ago that has the same carrier design as the 14 bolt, there are a few writeups out there. Supposed to be stronger than sh*t too

http://www.jeephorizons.com/tech/spider/spider.jpg

*EDIT* Here's a mega welded spider ball

http://h1.ripway.com/hawkfdc/1tonxj/IMG_0382.jpg

[ATL ZJ]

So...the question remains...looking back at when you built your 14, would it have been worth it at the time to drop a detroit in and be done with it?

If I'd seen one for sale on pirate for $300 (they come around occasionally), then I should have.

But now that my right foot can apply 400 ft/lb shock loads to my drivetrain, I won't install a detroit until my piggy bank is overflowing enough to install 300m shafts at the same time. Would really suck to break a shaft and the detroit, have to set gears in camp, and then buy another detroit when I got home.

I'll keep the reliability and handicap of the spool for now and hope it makes me a better driver for having to fight it. But your motor will probably be a little more reasonably powered and I doubt you'll drive as dumb as I do, so you'd probably be OK.

[paulkeith]

In light of the fact that I can create an orb of traction without wasting the carrier, i'll probably just go that route for now, and detroit when i go 5.38s.

I was stuck in the mindset of a non-separable carrier. Duh.

So I always wondered, what keeps the 4 pins from warping out of plane when you apply that much heat?

[Jeeptech01]

Curious too.

[AgitatedPancake]

good question, but I don't think it would matter much as long as you can get the carrier halves back together flush. You can use the bolts to cinch the carrier assembly back together.

[paulkeith]

Yeah, but given how sensitive a gear setup is, cranking the carrier like that has got to induce some sort of ring gear runout issues...? I'm sure for a primarily trail rig its a negligible concern.

[AgitatedPancake]

Well considering the length of this build...the 9" we did is under my buddies cherokee now, and will see some street miles. I'll tell ya how it's doing at the end of the summer :flipoff2:

No but really, I don't know maybe tack it solid with them in place, then preheat the hell out of it all and burn it all home, then drop it in a bucket of sand to cool for a day or two so the whole assembly heats and cools evenly

[paulkeith]

Well considering the length of this build...the 9" we did is under my buddies cherokee now, and will see some street miles. I'll tell ya how it's doing at the end of the summer :flipoff2:

No but really, I don't know maybe tack it solid with them in place, then preheat the hell out of it all and burn it all home, then drop it in a bucket of sand to cool for a day or two so the whole assembly heats and cools evenly

jackass! :D

I feel like I'm overthinking it. Easy to do when you're planning 98% and working on it 2%.

Probably strip the 14 down tonight. Need a 6 prong spindle socket to get the hubs off though....Cam you got one I can borrow?

Placed another order with Heleta so I can get back on bracket removal when that comes in.

[ATL ZJ]

Just tack it really well and then alternate sides when you weld it.

I did two at the same time (one for a friend) and neither of them warped past the point of being a good snug fit in the carrier.

[zjeepin]

jackass! :D

Probably strip the 14 down tonight. Need a 6 prong spindle socket to get the hubs off though....Cam you got one I can borrow?
.

just use a chisel and hammer to turn the locknuts.. there is a key that keeps them from turning and a spring that retains the key. i've tried several times to get the correct socket, no one that i've tried carries one..

[ATL ZJ]

just use a chisel and hammer to turn the locknuts.. there is a key that keeps them from turning and a spring that retains the key. i've tried several times to get the correct socket, no one that i've tried carries one..

6 prong d60 hub nut socket also fits it

[zjeepin]

6 prong d60 hub nut socket also fits it

i'll have to try that next time i have the 14 bolt apart.. when i built mine i couldn't find the correct socket

[paulkeith]

I bought whatever 6 prong socket advance/zone sells back in 05 or 06 and it fit. Just left it in SC.

Guess I'll just roll by the parts store on the way home, probably a tool I could use more than one of anyway....

[paulkeith]

pretty mundane shit, but I'm enjoying documenting it. knocked the 14 apart tonight:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0082Medium.jpg

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0083Medium.jpg

$19 at advance:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0088Medium.jpg

fit perfectly:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0084Medium.jpg

here's what came out...look right? same on both sides:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0085Medium.jpg

all done:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0086Medium.jpg

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0087Medium.jpg

reasons to not use normal sockets on an impact:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/paulkeith/cars/buggy/mar2010/IMG_0089Medium.jpg

Now for some beers and food.

Paul

[zjeepin]

your 14b has a different locknut system than mine. mines got a key that holds the outer locknut from moving and a sort of lockring/snapring that keeps the key in place..

[paulkeith]

Your system is what the book described and what I was expecting to find. Hmm.

edit:

checked the 14 bolt bible and both are pictured.

http://www.pirate4x4.com/tech/billavista/14b_bible/index.html

Tried hotlinking the pics but pirate may not allow that. One is towards the top and the other is about 1/3rd down.
http://www.pirate4x4.com/tech/billavista/14b_bible/images/DCP_6342.jpg

[zj95maxx]

you can always go with this style.
http://photos-h.ak.facebook.com/photos-ak-sf2p/v286/145/6/657390617/n657390617_3056943_306.jpg

pretty simple,and cheap.
You have to grind down the stubs a bit to fit inside the 14 bolt though...

[zjeepin]

whats the application on those locknuts maxx?

what locknut system did your 14er have in it?

[zj95maxx]

Well, my 14 came all pulled apart so there was no locknut style. I was going to use the one like you had, with the tiny little square key but then saw the locking system I posted above. It's actually for a front 60 but works for rear 14.

From my build..
"bought a newer style, first locknut goes on, washer with holes in it goes in and lines up with a nipple that was on the first nut, then the other locknut goes over the washer to keep everything in place.
http://i203.photobucket.com/albums/aa45/zj95maxx/DSCN1112.jpg

with everything on
http://i203.photobucket.com/albums/aa45/zj95maxx/DSCN1114.jpg"

[paulkeith]

Yeah, I saw a product pretty similar to what you've shown listed for the 60 on some websites.

[paulkeith]

Welp, here's a bit of an update...?

The D60 and boggers/locks are for sale.

A bit of no-bullshit situational analysis.....the financial and time resources for the old heap will be extremely slim to none for literally another 3.5 years. Just recently (last month) committed to more school that will now conclude in Dec 2013. Original plan was to focus time/effort on this thing after buying a house next summer, and that is out the window.

Losing the 60 and tires won't impact my ability to finish the rest of the systems & fab on the chassis as is, if/when i find finances/time to continue work. Having the money sit around for 3 years does me no good and right now could be put to use elsewhere.

So, sadface, wallow in pity, etc, etc. Life is moving in a different direction. I have thoughts of selling the whole thing, but nobody wants this chassis, and a TBI350/465/205 isn't exactly a holy grail.

[paulkeith]

May 2010. That's about right.

Sold off all the remaining components last fall. Have the chassis left and can't give it away for $350.

What a waste of money this was.

[ATL ZJ]

I'd say you got the rig's weight in gold worth of tough lessons.

Trying really hard to find a silver lining here...

[paulkeith]

Just funny the directions life goes. Whatever fueled my motivation for all those years to invest the sweat and dollars in the face of overwhelming odds that I'd never finish this thing.....I haven't felt that kind of passion or interest for a hobby for a long time.

I suppose you're right - was certainly educational. Maybe one magical day when I have "disposable income" and "time" I can try again. :shake:

[ATL ZJ]

Yep. It would have taken some serious free time and tunnel vision to accomplish what you had planned a whole state away.

Next time I recommend choosing LS power :mrgreen: