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MaineZJ
12-02-2004, 02:40 PM
Getting frustrated with the internet. Can't find much info on how to fix certain aspects of alignments, just "if this is happening, get it aligned"

Anyway, ZJ pulls to the right, no biggie, probably from being cheap with the lift.
Ouside of front tires wears (not sure if it's both or one) would this be from some toe-out or a castor issue?

gearhead313
12-03-2004, 10:36 AM
Toe-in or camber would do that. Camber isn't adjustable, so its probably toe.

I do almost all my alignements shade-tree style. First thing is make sure you have the front pinion angle right. It has to be an acceptable amount down so that the caster is back enough to let it track right. Don't point the front axle straight up inline with the DS. If you can't do this due to non-adjustable arms, you should be ok, don't worry about it (non-adjustable arms usually yield a low pinion angle)

With tow, you can get fancy and tape 2 yard sticks to the tire so that they protrude past the tire at least say 6". Do this on each side and then measure the back distance and then the front.

Also make sure the steering wheel is straight. Dont worry about pointing the tires straight, just the steering wheel. (the steering wheel can be straightened by moving the draglink in and out). Once you get the steering wheel straight, spend a good minute or two eyeing up the position of the tires to get an idea of where they are pointing. In some cases, the tires will BOTH point to one direction. If this is the case, first move the drag link adjuster to get both tires more straight. If this is a problem, you will have a crooked steering wheel. I've had the most luck simply eyeing up the tires with the yard sticks on them. That will get you close enough to start adjusting toe. once u have the toe set and the steering wheel is still not straight, go back and move the draglink adjuster to fine tune it. I usually drive it with it loose, and stop frequently to get out and tweek it... this is how we did it in the dealership!

Once you get both measurements from behind and infront of the tire, start adjusting the tierod sleeve to move the front of the tires in and out. Toe-in is (looking down on the vehicle from above):

//-----\\

Toe-out:

\\-----//


I like to put between 1/4 and a 1/2" toe out in it if the distance you measure between the front and back of the tire is around 4 foot.

NOTE: try to lock the steering wheel somehow with either a large bar or some other means. If you can't get it held real tight, simply check it after each time you adjust the tie-rod center link. This will ensure the most accurate readings. If you feel it did move, start the rig up and turn it back and forth slightly to regain the most centered position and then re-measure the distances behind the tires and in front.

Hope this helps, I may be forgetting a detail or 2.

JeepinHank
12-03-2004, 11:32 AM
Good writeup...

MaineZJ
12-03-2004, 11:58 AM
so you actually want some toe out? not in..
the only place I found with tires wearing on the outside, said that it was caused by the tire on the outside of the turn, not turning enough (too much toe out). That sound at all right?

OverkillZJ
12-03-2004, 12:36 PM
Good writeup, but um, TOE IN!

Kraqa
12-03-2004, 01:57 PM
the last allingment i did i eye balled my toe in tow out. i couldn't measure off the swampers are the sidewalls are ege shaped. and i didn't, for some reason, go off the rims.

seems to drive ok. my eye ball thinks it has a bit of toe out.

gearhead313
12-03-2004, 02:19 PM
I've heard a lot of people want toe-in, but for what reason, i have yet to hear.

Understand this situation:

stock XJ, went to 6" rusty's kit. When it is stock, the front end is in align, probably 0 toe. OK, so when you lift it, you lift the body away from the axle (i wish i could make a picture, but i can't right now). When you raise the vehicle, you raise the steering box that raises the draglink that pulls the centerlink up with the draglink making toe-in.

We took the XJ for a ride and deathwobbled like MAD! So took it back to my house, i did a "jason special" alignment and put a 1/4-1/2" of toe out and it fixed the deathwobble totally and hasn't worn the tires funny in over 5000miles now.


When the tires are toed in, the road force on the tires forces it to want to toe-in a lot more, that will make hte tires roll under a bit and cause the outside wear....and obviously it will feather the tire. They say most geometry will make the tires want to toe-in under braking and so forth... I could bust out my college books if you want... i had a class in alignments!

Kraqa
12-03-2004, 02:23 PM
actually with the inverted y setup it will toe out under breaking.

gearhead313
12-03-2004, 07:19 PM
actually with the inverted y setup it will toe out under breaking.

ya, your right...but thats hella more stable than toe-in fighting against eachother

OverkillZJ
12-03-2004, 09:05 PM
All the guru's and shops say toe in, the FSM says toe in, my toe in drives like a dream, I'll stick with tow in! :lol:

(where's the beer chug smiley?)

nate
12-04-2004, 10:14 AM
1/4"-1/2" of toe out? Whew... your going to kill tires quick.

Run around 0" to 1/8" of toe in and you should be good.

gearhead313
12-04-2004, 10:27 AM
you can't even see 1/8", ive run that on my grand that I took to florida 4 times and wore the tires perfect.

LouisianaZJ
12-06-2004, 03:19 AM
gearhead313 sent you a PM

nate
12-06-2004, 10:46 AM
Use a tape measure and you can see it. Maybe it's working for you, I'm not going to argue that.

I do tires, alignments, etc as a part time job so I'm not just making this stuff up.

gearhead313
12-06-2004, 02:11 PM
me neither. I went to school for chrysler for 2 years, 3 years at diamlers dealership, 3 years independent... im just going of what has worked for me.

if you measure it, you'll see. If you just walk up to it and its right, it will look mostly straight ahead, its better to measure...2, 3 times.