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PilotAustin
10-20-2010, 10:47 PM
So I HAVE used the search bar about this topic but all of the info is kinda old.

I am at the stage of taking my cladding off, grinding tabs, and welding the holes. Will be done tomorrow so I need to get this liner on before my flares get here. Also the carpet has been ripped out and floor stripped, ready for coating also.

Ok, First I have decided not to use duplicolor. Shit sucks

Second, I narrowed it down to either Herculiner or Rustoleum.

Just seeing if you guys have had better luck with one or the other and how you prepped to make it adhere better.

it usually runs fine
10-20-2010, 11:03 PM
I used herculiner on the rear cargo area and it is holding up well. I used some metal wool type stuff and scuffed the snot out of it and the cleaned it with alchohol wipes. When you go to the apply the herculiner you have to keep mixing it hardcore or all the abrasive pieces will settle to the bottom of the paint. I used a actual paintbrush to apply and I would do it agian, I recommend it. Also I used some left over and painted my rear bumper and after about a year and a half of being outside all the time in the weather it has faded to a flat black.

it usually runs fine
10-20-2010, 11:06 PM
Don't use bedliner on the inside IMO. It is mega hard to keep clean unless you cut holes in your floorboard and wash it out. I used astroturf in the passenger compartment and it turned out sick. the brown turf matches my interior and it was like 10$. I can still vaccuum it if I want and get it wet and muddy.

JordanA
10-21-2010, 09:22 AM
I would suggest Al's Liner, Herculiner, or a professional Line-x.

squashman702
10-21-2010, 09:56 AM
My buddy used Herc on the interior of his XJ and it's holding up well so far. It looks like it's going to be a bitch to clean though.

Hockinaloogie
10-21-2010, 10:11 AM
My buddy used Herc on the interior of his XJ and it's holding up well so far. It looks like it's going to be a bitch to clean though.


If you are going for looks just keep the stock carpet in there. I used Herculiner for the simple reason that when mud accumulates on the floor all I have to do is wait till it dries and do nothing. The wind takes care of the rest. When it gets all scuffed up it will look odd anyways.. I also used it because it is very strong and much less than a professional job. Take you about 6 hours to complete, that is if you take everything out, apply liner and put the shit back in.

Jeeptech01
10-21-2010, 10:39 AM
I know fortcollinsZJ used durabak when he removed his and it looked real good. My personal experience is with raptor liner on the interior of the WJ which was awesome. Another one that I have used alot on the xj and am very fond of is the rustoleum. I used it on the front bumper and the quarters. It still looks new after several washes and sitting out in the sun.

dp96zj
10-21-2010, 10:50 AM
I have herculiner on the outside (cladding area) of my Jeep. I didn't prep it great, so it has some pinholes in it where it's came off. However, unrelated to the prepping, it faded pretty quickly. I'd say within a year or so it was faded. Also, if your tires throw mud on it, and you don't wash it off within a day or so, the streaks from the mud will be still be visible. Ask me how I know.


This weekend I MAY just spray rustoleum over it, since it's starting to look like crap. In hindsight, I would've prepped it better, but it's still bound to fade. Check my build thread if you want pics.

squashman702
10-21-2010, 10:08 PM
If you are going for looks just keep the stock carpet in there. I used Herculiner for the simple reason that when mud accumulates on the floor all I have to do is wait till it dries and do nothing. The wind takes care of the rest. When it gets all scuffed up it will look odd anyways.. I also used it because it is very strong and much less than a professional job. Take you about 6 hours to complete, that is if you take everything out, apply liner and put the shit back in.

We totally redid the floors in his XJ and the carpet never would've gone back in due to the rocker cutouts/supports.

PilotAustin
10-22-2010, 01:28 AM
Well I decided on the herc and if it fades, it fades. I have pretty much stripped it down to the metal so I think it will be alright.

I really have not done much muddin lately due to I screw something up everytime I go, and my new Bushwacker Flares should take care of some of that.;)

Im not really going for looks on the inside due to I pulled the nasty old carpet out months ago. Im going for usability?
Going to try it on the cargo area first and see how it looks, then maybe up to the roof, then hood, then who knows....

THE WHOLE JEEP!
but prob not.
Ill post some pics if I can get my hands on a camera.

Jeeptech01
10-22-2010, 08:09 AM
Its not if it fades its when. Chances are if you prepped well it wont flake off. Just be sure to leave some deep sanding scratches for it to bite into.

FleshEater
03-04-2011, 09:25 PM
I just purchased my Herculiner this week and waiting for a little bit warmer weather. From what I've read this stuff turns into the rockies or something when it's dry and is impossible to clean. I suppose I'll be purchasing some plugs to drill holes into the floor; which wouldn't be a bad idea since I'm Hercuing the floor for when I sink it deep and the water rushes in. I should have known I would have found info on this here...Jeep Forum members had no experience with it.

I found JordanA's post on this earlier today...ZJ though. Any WJ snags to be prepared for? Mainly I'm concerned about running into wires I didn't expect and don't have any where to go. I was considering heat shrinking the exposed wires.

Does anybody notice a real heat difference in the cab? After I drove home from work today I put my hand on the floor where the tranny and firewall are and it didn't seem that hot...I mean it's 37 degrees but was still at normal running temperature.

Jeeptech01
03-05-2011, 10:45 AM
My old build has some info and pics in it. Its pretty straight forward. Almost all the harnesses run down either side on the sill. Park brake can be moved and tiewrapped out of the way.

FleshEater
03-05-2011, 11:37 AM
Jeeptech01: Do you like the bed liner better than carpet? What I hate about my carpet is that I question some mud holes because I don't want the hassle of pulling the carpet to clean the shit out of it. This is my DD but I don't have the money for a trail rig only so...I'm making this a miserable hunk of steel to drive around!

I was also thinking about customizing something for a new center console when I have everything torn out...really thinking of putting an ammo box in there or nothing at all. I really don't like the comfort, Cadillac look Chrysler attempted with the WJ...I want something that looks like it has balls!

Jeeptech01
03-05-2011, 01:05 PM
I liked it. If you coat over the sound deadener crap it may lift up in places though. IDK about removing the console though. I was so glad to have cup holders after having my 96 XJ. Plus I like having somewhere to rest my elbow when driving since Im a lefty.

JordanA
03-07-2011, 11:49 AM
I found JordanA's post on this earlier today...ZJ though. Any WJ snags to be prepared for? Mainly I'm concerned about running into wires I didn't expect and don't have any where to go. I was considering heat shrinking the exposed wires.


Heat shrinking the exposed wiring would be fine, I'm sure.

As far as heat, the liner I used (cannot remember which it was at this point... duplicolor, herc or something like that) did NOT insulate from heat. The tranny tunnel would get HOT AS BALLS and almost burn your leg if you weren't careful. One of the thicker liners (Line-x, Rhino) would work much better in this regard, as would a thermal bed liner (lizard skin).

FleshEater
03-07-2011, 08:49 PM
I would imagine if I'm unhappy with the heat after two coats of Herculiner I could always add another two...that should do a little to insulate it. If someone made an affordable vinyl or rubber flooring that would be the way to go...but it's all very expensive.

JordanA
03-08-2011, 12:45 PM
I'm telling you... lizard skin's ceramic coating is specifically used to insulate against heat. Look into it. You can always throw a layer of herc over the top of it if you so desire.

http://www.lizardskin.com/pages/ceramic.php

Jeeptech01
03-08-2011, 01:14 PM
I have a whole raptor liner kit in my garage that I may part with to find something that is better for insulation and sound deadening purposes. It was awesome but it didnt do much for sound deadening.

FleshEater
03-10-2011, 09:11 PM
I checked out that Lizard Skin ceramics and it looks pretty tough. Did you apply it under your bedliner? Just curious for some first hand experience with it. I mean I only have 3 months of semi hot weather so technically the heat would work in my favor for the rest of the year.

Bill94Zj
03-15-2011, 04:29 PM
I purchased the hurculiner kit, kinda second guts doing it because of the fact that it doesn't come clean very easily and from what I am reading it does stand up the best. The astroterf idea is interesting guess I would have to see what that looks like.

blackjack12982
03-20-2011, 07:54 PM
I finished doing the Monstaliner coating on the inside of my ZJ a few weeks ago, and after cleaning it out yesterday, I'm pleasantly surprised. It's held up well over the time it's been installed, I was worried about with the slight texture it being hard to clean, but it was super easy.

JordanA
03-21-2011, 08:53 AM
It's been a few weeks, and you're surprised it's held up???? Not trying to offend, but why take the time and exert the effort to install a liner you don't even trust to hold up more than a few weeks/months?

I'm glad it is holding up, though. Any pictures? I've never heard of the monsterliner myself, but I am guessing per your description that it's similar to herculiner (texture wise, at least).

blackjack12982
03-21-2011, 09:04 AM
It's been a few weeks, and you're surprised it's held up???? Not trying to offend, but why take the time and exert the effort to install a liner you don't even trust to hold up more than a few weeks/months?

I'm glad it is holding up, though. Any pictures? I've never heard of the monsterliner myself, but I am guessing per your description that it's similar to herculiner (texture wise, at least).

Ok, worded incorrectly I guess. I've had all my lift stuff rolling around in the back hatch, as well as a loaded Jobox (big ass toolbox) in it, with no scratches on it at all. We put the same Jobox in my buddies truck bed with sprayed in Rhinoliner in it, and it scratched it all the way through the bedliner.

Kinda a crappy pic, and it doesn't show the texture-
http://i1185.photobucket.com/albums/z349/robsmith012982/Willys018.jpg

JordanA
03-21-2011, 11:13 AM
Looks like it went on THICK (evident from the runs and what not). From the pictures it looks to have an extremely smooth texture compared to other DIY liners I've seen/used, which I would think implies that cleaning would be fairly easy.

Pics of the rhino scrathed through to the paint? Since the DIY liners essentially are high solid paints and roll/spray on with minimal thickness, it seems hard to believe that it could wistand this tool box, if it has in fact scratched through 1/8-1/4" of rhino liner.

I'm not doubting you, just having a hard time fathoming the situation, all things considered.

blackjack12982
03-21-2011, 03:59 PM
Yes, it's very thick in the passenger footwells and rear cargo area. I had 2 gallons, and realized it was way too much. The drivers feet area and the cargo area had 4 coats, versus 3 coats in the other footwells, versus 2 under the seats/side areas.

I don't have any pics of the Rhinoliner, but comparing the thickness of it to the thickness that I applied in my ZJ doesn't compare at all. The Rhinoliner was installed at the dealership immediately after purchase. The exposed factory paint area looked to have no prep on it at all for the Rhinoliner. I would have to imagine that had a large factor in the easy scratching, but there still is hardly any thickness at all in the Rhinolining.

Edit- Rereading your post again, there was absolutely no way that the Rhinolining was 1/8-1/4 thick at all.

JordanA
03-21-2011, 04:38 PM
Dealer screw up, then. I think the average installed thickness for a regular coating of Rhino is around 1/8".

blackjack12982
03-21-2011, 09:14 PM
Dealer screw up, then. I think the average installed thickness for a regular coating of Rhino is around 1/8".

Yeah, that's what we thought too. I wonder how many people get that kind of shoddy bedlining?

FleshEater
03-22-2011, 09:49 AM
I actually contacted Monstaliner with a few questions/concerns. How did the Monstaliner hold the heat down in the cab? I've come to the conclusion that if the heat becomes a factor with my Herculiner job I'll be sanding it a bit and applying Monstaliner on top of it.

JordanA
03-22-2011, 10:28 AM
What did Monstaliner have to say?

blackjack12982
03-22-2011, 11:10 AM
I actually contacted Monstaliner with a few questions/concerns. How did the Monstaliner hold the heat down in the cab? I've come to the conclusion that if the heat becomes a factor with my Herculiner job I'll be sanding it a bit and applying Monstaliner on top of it.

It never even occured to me before I read this thread about the risk in increasing the heat inside the cab, and I was pretty worried about it as I installed it. It was mid 70's yesterday, and I drove down the interstate for a little over an hour. I was able to place my hand on the tranny tunnel, and could tell it was warmer than with the carpet, but it wasn't nearly as bad as others have said their bedliners were. By no means would it scald your legs if you touched it. I'll definitely keep an eye on it as it gets hotter outside.

JordanA
03-22-2011, 11:15 AM
my first DIY liner, duplicolor I believe, would literally allow the heat from the tranny tunnel to burn your leg.

blackjack12982
03-22-2011, 11:22 AM
my first DIY liner, duplicolor I believe, would literally allow the heat from the tranny tunnel to burn your leg.

Yeah, like I said, I saw this thread right before I applied it, and it's one of the reasons that I applied it so thick/so many coats over the tranny tunnel. I'm definitely glad I did, there's no way I would live with burning my legs everytime I drove anywhere.

FleshEater
03-22-2011, 08:58 PM
Monstaliner said (if my memory serves me right) that they weren't sure how it would reduce the heat but said that the Lizard Skin wouldn't be the best thing to apply before applying a bed coating. However, they did say that if my Herculiner doesn't do it for me I can sand a little of it and apply the Monstaliner on top.

Personally...I think this is a try and see what happens situation. There are not enough ZJ, WJ, XJ write ups to support a solid 100% conclusion. So I'm going to apply the Herculiner as best as I can and see how the heat is. If it's bad I'll apply Monstaliner if it's not bad I'll leave it be. Had I heard about Monstaliner before Herc I would have bought the Monsta.

I'll log on to MC through my place of employment and post the e-mail they sent me back. He said it was a good question and was going into the FAQ.

Jeeptech01
03-22-2011, 09:50 PM
I think my raptor liner made a significant difference in the interior heat but honestly I think the thickness makes a difference when sprayed inside the pass compartment more than the media. Now if you sprayed the undercarriage reflective properties come into play at that point.

SirFuego
03-22-2011, 09:57 PM
I just bought a roll of that reflective insulation you can get from any hardware store and cut it to fit around the transmission tunnel. That worked wonders at keeping the heat down -- although it's not exactly the most eye-pleasing solution. Although you could probably figure out a way to cover it without it looking purely functional.

JordanA
03-23-2011, 12:26 AM
Monstaliner said (if my memory serves me right) that they weren't sure how it would reduce the heat but said that the Lizard Skin wouldn't be the best thing to apply before applying a bed coating. However, they did say that if my Herculiner doesn't do it for me I can sand a little of it and apply the Monstaliner on top.

Personally...I think this is a try and see what happens situation. There are not enough ZJ, WJ, XJ write ups to support a solid 100% conclusion. So I'm going to apply the Herculiner as best as I can and see how the heat is. If it's bad I'll apply Monstaliner if it's not bad I'll leave it be. Had I heard about Monstaliner before Herc I would have bought the Monsta.

I'll log on to MC through my place of employment and post the e-mail they sent me back. He said it was a good question and was going into the FAQ.

No offense, but I would take what Monstaliner had to say about using competitor's products with a grain of salt. That's like asking a Chevy dealer to tell you why NOT to buy a Ford.

FleshEater
03-23-2011, 07:14 AM
Here you go to better/further explain and understand what was conversed. My original question concerned heat and sound...


Hi

Heat and sound dampening are mainly conquered with film thickness. Anything you put between the heat or noise source will do something to reduce them but the thicker you go the more effective it becomes.

Lizard skin probably does better by itself than any DIY bedliner. Part of the reason it may be better for sound is that it's recommended to be applied thicker than most DIY bed liners. It's also quite expensive for the coverage recommended. I've played with Lizardskin. It's almost like peanut butter in consistency. Basically a latex paint with a lot of filler. The filler is a light weight, hollow ceramic particle and because it's basically filled with air it may be better in dissipating heat/sound but I still think it's more a function of thicker is better

Raptor will be no different than any other DIY liner as it is thin and has no special fillers or ceramic.

Monstaliner has a solid ceramic filler more for durability and abrasion resistance and because it's designed to go on thicker than other DIY products it will do better for sound dampening. It does shield some heat and withstands heat very well.

Herculiner in reality, is a very thin coating that appears thicker than it really is because the rubber particles are much larger than the thickness of the coating and they stand way above the coating surface when it's dry.

I would use the Herc you already have and consider adding additional coats of something when you see/hear the results.

Today was your lucky day as I don't usually write this much but it was a great question that I'm using for an updated FAQ

I hope this helped.

Regards
Eric



Eric Rosenthal
President & Technical Director
631.842.7700 - Ext 100
Cell: 516.313.7865
www.magnetpaints.com (http://www.magnetpaints.com/)


www.monstaliner.com (http://www.monstaliner.com)

More detail about Lizard Skin:

A few have asked if Lizardskin could be installed first and I think yes. The problem with doing that is the Lizard stuff stays relatively soft and pliable for quite some time (months) before it really hardens well and if you put a bedliner over that on a walkable surface it may dent and is kind of unpredictable regarding long term durability.

I don't think Liz Skin was designed to be walkable by itself as it's usually used under carpet or on the back of body panels and in concealed areas. People use it as alternate to Dynomat

JINX
03-25-2011, 04:10 PM
Just for FYI .
There are drain plugs in the front pans of a ZJ.
They are oval in shape and glued in.
You can use the same replacement rubber plug for a TJ rear passenger drain whole.
The ZJ rear seat pans have 2 plugs each.
I have a thread on this somewhere on this site.
I got the plugs off ebay for 2 each. Drains fine

blackjack12982
03-25-2011, 04:28 PM
Just for FYI .
There are drain plugs in the front pans of a ZJ.
They are oval in shape and glued in.
You can use the same replacement rubber plug for a TJ rear passenger drain whole.
The ZJ rear seat pans have 2 plugs each.
I have a thread on this somewhere on this site.
I got the plugs off ebay for 2 each. Drains fine

Wow, I wish I would've known that before I coated them over. I looked and didn't see any that were blatantly obvious. I was gonna source a set of marine plugs.

JordanA
03-28-2011, 06:21 PM
Wow, I wish I would've known that before I coated them over. I looked and didn't see any that were blatantly obvious. I was gonna source a set of marine plugs.

I believe they're beneath the glue/insulation crap that comes from the factory. Unless you removed that prior to coating, you'd never have seen them.

blackjack12982
03-28-2011, 07:15 PM
I removed the carpet/insulation underneath it. I also removed the foam that was on the firewall in the footwells, however, I didn't remove the glued on body color painted "whatever". I've read the horror stories of trying to remove that gummy mess.

JordanA
03-28-2011, 09:28 PM
Yeah I didn't bother with it, either.

JINX
04-01-2011, 12:06 AM
The oval shape plugs are almost right in the middle of each section of floor pan. They are glued down but a heat gun and a small sturdy scraper pulls them right up with no problem.
They have clips on either end that you have to bend in. But nothing difficult.
Here is the link to the replacement ones. They fit right in. Very cheap compared to the dealer $8.00 version.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Swap-Steel-Floor-Drain-Plug-w-Rubber-Jeep-Wrangler-TJ-_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQfitsZModelQ3aTJQQhashZitem5640b 401d7QQitemZ370452726231QQptZMotorsQ5fCarQ5fTruckQ 5fPartsQ5fAccessories

FleshEater
04-07-2011, 01:36 PM
Has anyone removed the insulation glued or welded (no idea what this stuff is) to the floor of their ZJ or WJ? I'm not sure if the XJ and TJ guys have this stuff but I know the WJ does. It's all over the bare metal floor in squares with a bubbly top...I believe I read it's a "tar" like material.

Just trying to figure out whether or not it's worth trying to tear out or just leave it and deal with it.

Also, when you guys were rolling the bed liner on how did you plug the bolt holes? The instructions suggest shoving tape down in there but I'm not to sure of using that method...I was thinking of just leaving the bolts in their holes and taping around them in a square.

Also decided to buy another Herculiner kit and install both...I'll let you know how it holds the heat/road noise out.

JordanA
04-07-2011, 01:48 PM
1. Yes... it's been covered more than a few times on here.
2. tape works great for the bolt holes, don't over-complicate this.

Search, and you shall find.

FleshEater
04-08-2011, 06:51 AM
Sorry...found it after a couple searches.

After reading I don't think it's worth the effort to remove it and it's a foam sealer to stop moisture from creeping through the floor welds so in PA it's probably a good idea to leave it.