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cLAYH
03-28-2009, 12:38 PM
I think some of you may appreciate this.

Background: Loading a slide in camper sucks! Typically when we head out for a trip we load a 12ft camper into the back of the truck, then hook up trailer, load jeep and camper. The difficulties with this are as follows:

1) loading camper onto truck cann't be done till just before leaving as I use the truck for work
2)camper overhangs trailer and makes it difficult to hook up, I've also tagged the camper jacks with the trailer tongue on uneven ground making sharp turns, loading camper is difficult as you are tripping over the trailer tongue
3)space is limited, we have 2 kids and 2 dogs..... plus stuff
4)cann't take truck to town or errands without packing camper up

So for these reasons and few others we are going to build are own Toy Hauler using a 30ft GN flatdeck trailer and an older 5th wheel. Hopefully this way all I have to do is back under the GN, hook up and go. This will also leave the truck more available for the wife to take day trips when she doesn't want to come wheeling.

5th has a total length of 22ft and the main "body" is 15.5ft. It will sit on the front part of the GN trailer with the overhang over the GN hitch. This will leave aprox 14.5ft of deck space for the Jeep. Hoping to keep total cost under 10K.

Got the piceses just need to assemble! :rolleyes:


http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u92/clayhardock/ToyHauler%20Build/6782f44_20.jpg

http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u92/clayhardock/ToyHauler%20Build/2395f7m_20.jpg

UTChavok
03-28-2009, 12:52 PM
This looks interesting, keep the updates coming on it.

Goosed76
03-28-2009, 01:34 PM
Looks interesting. Whats the tow vehicle?

Mtn WJ
03-28-2009, 01:52 PM
How long is you Jeep. 14.5 feet seems a little tight for you Jeep to fit in the back.

FrozenZJ
03-28-2009, 03:51 PM
Did that once but started with a wrecked 5th wheel frame. Stuck a slide in on the front and decked out the back. Ended up with a bunch of storage and huge tanks for the slide in.

When we didnt haul the jeep, we built a tent covering and we had a huge covered deck.

Should have kept it.

albertazj
03-28-2009, 06:48 PM
Did that once but started with a wrecked 5th wheel frame. Stuck a slide in on the front and decked out the back. Ended up with a bunch of storage and huge tanks for the slide in.

When we didnt haul the jeep, we built a tent covering and we had a huge covered deck.

Should have kept it.

That is what i'm thinking of doing, will have to watch this thread for ideas

cLAYH
03-28-2009, 09:07 PM
Hey AlbertaZJ, are you going to the Event in Grand Cache this summer? It will probably be there.

I have a 2003 Dodge 3500, dually, 4x4 to drag it around with.

I thought about putting the camper I have now on there(12ft Bronco) but its so cramped inside and having to fold the table into a bed at night and then back into a table in the morning and stowing all the bedding was getting annoying. Plus when it was raining and the family was couped up in there it was pretty tight.

The new 5th wheel has a pullout bench that is out of the way enough that it can stay folded out. Kids can sleep there at night and during the day they can spread their toys out on it.

I'm thinking about making a sub frame that I can easily pin some jacks into. Then if I want to use just the flat deck for a big load or just the 5th wheel for a non-wheeling trip I can remove the 5th wheel from the flat deck fairly easily.

I have measured my Jeep and only need 13 ft of deck space for it to sit on. The rear end can hang out over the back if needed. So from the front of my winch to the edge of my back tires is 13ft. With 14.5ft of deck space I'll probably have about 1/2 ft hanging off the back.

cLAYH
03-28-2009, 09:18 PM
I had to look around for quite awhile to find this particular GN flatdeck. I needed a 30ft trailer but I did NOT want a triple axle unit or a beaver tail. Triple axle units put the weight rating over 22,000# and that means a really HEAVY frame and thus heavy trailer. This unit has two 8000# axles and is rated for 17,000#. Plenty of GVW for my plans put not overly heavy. 7k axles would have worked but would have cut it close.

I didn't want a rear dovetail as it reduces the back end ground clearance. Also then you usually end up with flip up ramps and that wouldn't work if the back of the jeep hangs off the rear of the trailer.

Also triple axle trailers with dovetails are about twice the price of what I paid for this unit. :grin:

albertazj
03-28-2009, 10:31 PM
Hey AlbertaZJ, are you going to the Event in Grand Cache this summer? It will probably be there.
didn't know about it, i got some axles to put in before i go anywhere
which club puts it on?

cLAYH
03-29-2009, 12:36 PM
http://myjeeptj.com/2008/08/24/ace-2008-the-alberta-4x4-club-conference-on-the-environment

Here is a blog about it from last year's event. I haven't been to one yet but hope to this summer. Invites were sent to most of the well known clubs that have shown to be responsible wheelers. If your club didn't get an invite just e-mail Corey Kruchkowski, cdkruchk@telusplanet.net, for more info.

Mtn WJ
03-30-2009, 10:05 AM
The trailer I liked was the one from Extreme 4x4. The put a pop up on the front sideways. It took less than 10 feet off of the front and had a bunch of room inside when it was opened up. The only thing I didnt like was the fact you have to walk up on the deck to get into it. I suppose you could consider it a patio to coincide with the camper.

cLAYH
03-30-2009, 07:05 PM
I actually would have prefered a rear entry like a slide in camper. Would have been cool to use the deck as a rear patio. Also would have made getting in and out of the unit easier.

As it is I'm not quite sure how I'm going to work stairs coming off of the side. I'm got 2 small kids as well so it need to be something they can get up as well.

LSRGreg
03-30-2009, 07:14 PM
looks cool.. i want to see how it looks when finished.

g-

ajmorell
03-30-2009, 07:49 PM
The trailer I liked was the one from Extreme 4x4. The put a pop up on the front sideways. It took less than 10 feet off of the front and had a bunch of room inside when it was opened up. The only thing I didnt like was the fact you have to walk up on the deck to get into it. I suppose you could consider it a patio to coincide with the camper.

They didn't build that, they bought it that way.

http://www.fourwheeler.com/roadtests/129_0607_2006_fleetwood_scorpion_s2_camper_hauler/index.html

Mtn WJ
03-30-2009, 08:25 PM
The Spike Networks - Powerblock - Extreme 4x4 show built one from scratch.

http://www.powerblocktv.com/site3/index.php/xtreme4x4-episodes?ep_num=XT2006-19&ep_sea=0602

Here is a link you might like. Scroll down a bit

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=761041

cLAYH
03-31-2009, 12:37 AM
Thanks for the links, some good ideas there.

Katesdad
04-05-2009, 08:33 PM
Ive seen this done with a guy that had a pulling tractor. Its doable I think youll enjoy it!

cLAYH
04-05-2009, 10:28 PM
I installed the 5th wheel hitch on the truck yesterday. What a screw up that was. The new Dodges use a tube or boxed frame. You cann't bolt anything to it. Most kits come with a VERY expensive u-bolt/clamp setup that goes around the frame to secure the hitch rails. I got a DSP hitch with the trailer so I picked up a bracket kit for my truck('03 Dodge 3500). The kit was much cheaper than competitiors bracket kits so I asked them to double check it was the right one. They said it was. Well after getting under the truck I don't think so. It was obvisously a drill/bolt on. Fine for C channel but not going to work for a tube frame.

In the end I said screw it and just welded it on. Probably less work than drilling would have been anyway.

Now that its on I picked up the 5th wheel and moved all my stuff from my old camper into it. Even though its not on the gooseneck, next weekend we're going to take it out for a test run. Make sure everything works and figure out where we want stuff.

cLAYH
04-19-2009, 11:25 PM
Whew! I've cranked enough jacks today to last me a year! I built a platform to lift up the 5th wheel using 2" ID reciever tube and some trailer jacks. Two lengths of 2" tube were welded across the bottom of the frame and then 2" OD tube was welded to the trailer jacks and then inserted into the receiver tube. Then the 5th wheel was lifted up in stages using its own landing jacks and the trailer jacks. Once it was high enough I backed the GN under it. Unfortunately the pin box on the 5th wheel wouldn't clear the neck on the GN and I had maxed the jacks out. So I had to drop the 5th wheel onto the the deck of the GN and throw some rims under the jacks to give it a bit more height. I then dropped the pin box of the 5th wheel into the 'V' of the GN hitch. Here are some pics.

http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u92/clayhardock/ToyHauler%20Build/IMG_3378.jpg

http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u92/clayhardock/ToyHauler%20Build/IMG_3379.jpg

http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u92/clayhardock/ToyHauler%20Build/IMG_3380.jpg

http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u92/clayhardock/ToyHauler%20Build/IMG_3381.jpg

http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u92/clayhardock/ToyHauler%20Build/IMG_3382.jpg

http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u92/clayhardock/ToyHauler%20Build/IMG_3383.jpg

http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u92/clayhardock/ToyHauler%20Build/IMG_3384.jpg

http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u92/clayhardock/ToyHauler%20Build/IMG_3385.jpg

http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u92/clayhardock/ToyHauler%20Build/IMG_3385.jpg

http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u92/clayhardock/ToyHauler%20Build/IMG_3388.jpg

http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u92/clayhardock/ToyHauler%20Build/IMG_3390.jpg

http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u92/clayhardock/ToyHauler%20Build/IMG_3391.jpg

Last summer I invested in 2 fire extinguishers. I'm always doing goofy projects involving grinders/welders as well I run a grass cutting business in the summer and figured it would be a good idea to have one in the truck in case I started a grass fire. Well today having that extinguisher paid off. I was doing this project at my parents acerage and was a fair distance away from the house. I was on top of the neck of the GN trailer grinding off the spare tire mount when I noticed that the sparks from the grinder had ignited the grass. There was just a small spot about the size of a dinner plate burning but with the stiff wind that was blowing it was quickly growing. By the time I got down off of the trailer it was about 4ft in diameter. I started to stamp it out but was only making it worse. I started for the RV to get a pot of water but then remembered I had drained the tanks. I started for the house thinking to get a jug of water but knew that by the time I got back it would be WAY out of control. Finally I remembered the fire extinguisher in the truck. I grabbed it and in no time the fire was out. By the time it was all done I had a burn patch about 10feet long and 4feet wide. This all happened in probably less than 2 minutes! I spent the next hour mounting my weed sprayer on my quad and soaking the ground around where I was working with soapy water before even going near the grinder again!

http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u92/clayhardock/ToyHauler%20Build/IMG_3386.jpg


Now I just have to decide how I want to tie it down and wire the 5th wheel into the GN wiring.

MoonWorks
04-20-2009, 12:19 AM
Lookin Good!

cLAYH
05-19-2009, 10:49 PM
Took it out for its maidian voyage this weekend. Worked great! Towed great!

http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u92/clayhardock/Four%20Wheel%20Stampepeder%20Runs/2009%20May%20Long/IMG_3399.jpg

Works as an RTI ramp as well!

http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u92/clayhardock/Four%20Wheel%20Stampepeder%20Runs/2009%20May%20Long/IMG_3401.jpg

LouisianaZJ
05-19-2009, 11:28 PM
what do you estimate the loaded & unloaded weight is?

cLAYH
05-19-2009, 11:47 PM
I'm guessing 13-14K loaded with jeep. Take about 5K off that without the jeep.

Rides nice with the Jeep on but is a bit harsh without the jeep to counterbalance the pin weight.

Mtn WJ
05-20-2009, 09:48 AM
Well you did it.

Looks good. Are you planning on putting some kind of trim around the exposed areas under the camper?

cLAYH
05-20-2009, 07:27 PM
Yep, probably fab up some doors to make storage in the wheel wells. Not a huge rush though, just looking forward to enjoying it.

MUDDTRACKS
05-20-2009, 10:50 PM
Looks good man.

cLAYH
07-10-2009, 08:33 PM
Here's a few more pics from the last trip.

http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u92/clayhardock/ToyHauler%20Build/DSC_3602.jpg

http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u92/clayhardock/ToyHauler%20Build/DSC_3609.jpg

http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u92/clayhardock/ToyHauler%20Build/DSC_3614.jpg

http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u92/clayhardock/ToyHauler%20Build/DSC_3638.jpg

The loading ramps are usually at a steeper angle I just found a dip to pull the trailer into this time.

I tried moving the ZJ back on the deck this time as opposed to last trip where I had it pulled as far forward as possible. It defiantly reduced the hitch weight on the truck and made it ride better.

chadjans
07-13-2009, 12:20 AM
It defiantly reduced the hitch weight on the truck and made it ride better.

Time to make the ZJ lighter.

cLAYH
07-14-2009, 11:42 PM
Umm no, it has nothing to do with the ZJ being too heavy. Its having all the weight of the 5th wheel forward of the axles. Moving the ZJ back counterbalances the weight of the 5th wheel and takes weight off the hitch. :screwy:

LoganZJ
07-15-2009, 12:35 AM
Umm no, it has nothing to do with the ZJ being too heavy. Its having all the weight of the 5th wheel forward of the axles. Moving the ZJ back counterbalances the weight of the 5th wheel and takes weight off the hitch. :screwy:

:rofl: First time chad ever gets owned (prob last time too)

chadjans
07-15-2009, 02:34 AM
Umm no, it has nothing to do with the ZJ being too heavy. Its having all the weight of the 5th wheel forward of the axles. Moving the ZJ back counterbalances the weight of the 5th wheel and takes weight off the hitch. :screwy:

Weight is weight. So having a heavy ass jeep is good? I fail to see how making the jeep lighter would be detramental.

Please do explain.

AgitatedPancake
07-15-2009, 12:49 PM
it would take less weight off the hitch, so towing this contraption wouldn't be quite as nice...I believe thats the point he was trying to make.

cLAYH
07-17-2009, 03:00 PM
Yes, that is my point. For wheeling making the Jeep lighter would be good. But for this discussion the weight is irrelevant, if the jeep was lighter I'd have to move it back even more. The hitch weight onto the truck can easily be changed by moving the Jeep 6" forward or back. Because the majority of the Jeep is BEHIND the axles it doesn't put weight on the hitch but actually takes it off.

Think of the trailer as a see-saw with the wheels being the pivot point. Moving the jeep forward and back will change the way it balances.

Without the Jeep on at all its a pretty harsh ride.

Weight is weight, but balance is key....

SleepCrawler
12-08-2009, 12:54 PM
Very nice.. I like it!!

RedRock4x4
12-08-2009, 03:28 PM
Awesome contraption! What about backing the Jeep onto the trailor.Then you have the weight of the engine behind the trailor wheels making the hitch weight even less.Im sure backing up those ramps would be an even bigger rush then anything on the trail hahaa

cLAYH
01-15-2010, 01:50 AM
Thanks for the compliment.

Yep it probably would take more weight off the hitch but its balanced quite nicely there. I screwed some 2X4 down to the deck, when I feel the wheels roll over them I know I'm in the right spot.

Plus I often put camping stuff or kids toys(like the Power wheels Jeep) in the back of the ZJ. I don't think the hatch would open if it was backed on.