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View Full Version : Flame suit is on..towing question



zj95maxx
02-11-2008, 08:51 PM
I know, I know, this shouldn't be done. But, if its all I got, what do you think. Towing once every month or two an hour away and 4 times a year to bigdogs(4 hours). My mom has a 2005 Ford Explorer XLT. It is a 6 cylinder, but the thing has some power, its decently long. If I hooked it up with trailer brakes, think it could tow the jeep? I know its not Ideal like I said, and i know it would hate life going up hills and whatnot, but thats fine with me, just wondering if it can be done. I think it would handle it fine, just would rev a bit higher.

Ready for flame:smt067

canadian_driver
02-11-2008, 08:54 PM
id hit it

BigDaveZJ
02-11-2008, 08:57 PM
What's the Explorer rated to tow? Your rig's gotta be a solid 5k lbs, so by the time you get an adequate trailer now you're at 7k lbs.

EDIT: And moving the Jeep/trailer is the least of your concerns, controlling the trailer and stopping it are priority one.

AgitatedPancake
02-11-2008, 09:01 PM
With all the tube work in that ZJ I could see it being heavier than 5k, but either way I bet your going to be over the max of the explorer by quite a ways.

ILikeMud
02-11-2008, 09:02 PM
I towed the old ZJ with my Uncles 03 or 04 Z71 Tahoe. It had trouble braking, was a bit slow and revved high but what can you do.
My uncle and cousin tow their TJ with it every now and then and what no issues.

zj95maxx
02-11-2008, 09:03 PM
Think being a bit over the load limit is a HORRIBLE thing? I dont know the load rating offhand...as for stopping, like I said, I will be using a quality trailer and getting trailer brakes hooked up for the explorer..

ILikeMud
02-11-2008, 09:06 PM
According to Edmunds.com the limits are...
5380lbs for the 2wd V6.
5760lbs for the 4wd V6.

Yes, being over the limit is a bad and unsafe thing.

zj95maxx
02-11-2008, 09:06 PM
and i know it isnt IDEAL, but like i said, its what I got..

SirFuego
02-11-2008, 09:12 PM
I just looked on Ford's website and the 2008 V6 Exploders with 3.55s are only rated to tow 3500 and those with the 3.73s are just over 5000lbs. Whats your mother's geared at? Towing that far over the weight limit will probably beat the snot out of the transmission.

My friend towed a couple times with a V8 WJ and he said that it was pretty scary -- especially when he didn't have the tongue weight correct. The tranny was getting the snot kicked out of it going up some of the hills. He had to be constantly alert and in control and it definitely was far from ideal. He got the tongue weight wrong at the beginning and the trailer literally almost forced them into a ditch.

After an incident at Rausch Creek, he needed to tow his TJ back with my truck (Ram 1500 Quad Cab shortbed with the Hemi). He said that the difference was night and day.

Personally, I would take the chance by driving the ZJ there until you get a real tow rig. Shouldn't take too long with your money tree ;)

BigDaveZJ
02-11-2008, 09:14 PM
and i know it isnt IDEAL, but like i said, its what I got..


Just cuz it's what ya got doesn't mean it's a good idea.

zj95
02-11-2008, 09:53 PM
use one of your money trees to buy a tow rig, or finance one...

sevenslats
02-11-2008, 11:37 PM
I know, I know, this shouldn't be done...

B I N G O .

AprilzWarrior
02-12-2008, 12:39 AM
Think being a bit over the load limit is a HORRIBLE thing?


Well when you cannot stop properly and kill someone what do you think ?


Those ratings are given for a reason.







I dont mean to come off too harsh, but I always think of my family when I see/hear of other people being stupid or unsafe on our roads and how dangerous/reckless others can be.

Dirtdiver
02-12-2008, 12:56 AM
Not mention what type of trailer ur going to use, single or double axle, ramps or tilt bed? These things will add weight you need to take into consideration. Trailer bracks will slow you down but its not going do a damn if your over you tow weight, it'll shove you right through stop signs and not to mention the vehicle in front of you. Why not find a V8 truck just for towing, gotta be an auction around you could find something to tow with. A few grand for a tow rig or more money for the accident you cause.

rsl
02-12-2008, 02:42 AM
If you don't have the trailer already you can forget about renting it from U-haul because they state on the front of all their towing agreements (even if you are using something else) that it is their policy to not rent towing equipment to be towed by Ford Explorers. Noticed that when I rented a dolly to tow a parts Grand Am home.

A couple months later I flat towed a 94 ZJ home 200 miles with my 93 ZJ and a tow bar and don't recommend that method to anyone. I really need to get a dedicated tow rig, 3/4 ton 2wd at least but it isn't in the cards right know.

MoonWorks
02-12-2008, 01:14 PM
Hadn't read this until after I answered your pm. The WJ I towed with it quite a bit different than your moms explorer. Start looking for an old used pickup. Atleast a half ton if nothing else. I looked on and off for about a year before I got my 250 ('92). Just a had a buddy of mine tow me a few times, borrowed my brother in laws 150 once and then used the wj twice. Look around in your circle of family and friends and see who has a truck. Ask them to come along with you on your trip or if they wouldn't mind you using their truck for the weekend.

You'll see need a trailer (obviously). Make sure the truck has a break box. And with quite a few 1/2 tons you'll still need load bars depending on the trailer used.

J B
02-12-2008, 01:23 PM
This, unfortunately, is where people don't understand the cost of their hobbies. It's not just the cost of the jeep, it's the cost of getting all of your shit to and from the trail, especially if it breaks. And not having an adequate tow vehicle is simply a cost of your JEEP. This exact issue is part of the reason that I don't wheel as often as I'd like, and that I never venture more than a few hours from home.....because even though my ZJ is perfectly roadworthy, if it breaks and I can't fix it on site, I'm screwed.

I read a thread the other day about a guy bitching about his new Corvette...he bought this brand new Vette, but he lives in Ohio and has no garage to keep it in, and it's his only car. With all of the weather they have had, the car is frozen up, and he can't get into it, so he's stranded.

So here this dumbass is, DDing a $50k sports car, and has no garage.

This situation isn't quite that bad, but you need to understand the implications of what you're doing, which is putting everyone around you at risk towing a rig like that with an Explorer.

FearTheDentist
02-12-2008, 01:23 PM
One of my patients was killed last year as a result of towing a trailer that was too heavy for the capacity of their truck. Coming back from San Diego a crosswind got them fishtailing, flipped the whole thing and she died of a head injury. You're right that you probably would be fine, but a little bit of bad luck can escalate quickly and result in very serious consequences on you or others.

1fox2go
02-12-2008, 03:09 PM
I wouldnt recommend it. My friend used an f150 to haul his Cherokee and it sucked. Plus around here man I been told people have been getting busted for being over loaded. Me and my dad work on peoples Cummins that haul loads and they said they see people getting stopped now.

You need at least a v8 1/2 ton truck. 3/4 would be the way to go

Cody
02-12-2008, 06:23 PM
I towed a lighter setup than you have with a v8 ZJ for a bit.

Bad idea.

If you had a civic would you try and tow with it because "it's what you got"?

Perhaps you should have addressed how to transport your super built ZJ before you took it past the point of un-road-worthyness. Just a thought.

1fox2go
02-12-2008, 06:28 PM
I dont think its unworthy for the road, I think he means so if he breaks at big dogs, which is a long drive for him, he can tow it home.

The ideal setup would be a diesel, if you can't get that at least a 1/2 ton. Like I said the f150 sucked hauling the Cherokee but it pulled it. Just slow

OverkillZJ
02-12-2008, 06:30 PM
I'd have to say bad idea.

phil3604
02-12-2008, 09:09 PM
As a retired/disabled police officer, I can say, without a doubt, that this is a VERY, VERY BAD idea. I know its not what you want to hear, but the truth sometime hurts. You have to think of it this way, if that one little thing goes wrong, at BEST you have totally destroyed not only your ZJ and your MOTHER's Explorer and maybe walk away and not get yourself seriously injured or killed...but WORST case all this happens to you AND the soccer mom and her kids in the mini van that just happen to be on the road as the same time as you. I've seen it happen, and it ain't pretty. Seriously it just isn't worth taking the chance and having something go TERRIBLY wrong. Because as we all know, once it does you can't undo the damage.

OverkillZJ
02-12-2008, 09:32 PM
I think that about sums it up....

KDUB
02-12-2008, 09:47 PM
x eleventybillion to phil's post.

jeeperanthony
02-12-2008, 09:55 PM
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Chevrolet-Crew-Cab-1973-Runs-Well-3-4-ton-NO-Reserve_W0QQitemZ270209727843QQcmdZViewItem?hash=i tem270209727843
haul a trailer over with the Z, pick up the truck, and put the Z on the trailer:cool:

AprilzWarrior
02-12-2008, 10:35 PM
This thread is done.

Good post Phil :smt023

Skyline
02-12-2008, 11:48 PM
Why not just take the chance of driving the ZJ to where you want to go? If it breaks, go to a local U-Haul, rent a truck and a trailer and tow the busted ZJ home. If it doesn't break, save your money and drive home.

ATL ZJ
02-13-2008, 12:28 AM
Maxx,

When my Jeep was retired from daily driver status, I passed on a FREE 1998 Mercury Mountaineer with 5.0l V8 that was in excellent condition because I realized I needed a vehicle that would tow my Jeep safely. I ended up with a older truck with WAY more miles, but could relax in the fact that I knew I wasn't putting others in danger. I also actually drove my Jeep/buggy to the last trail ride because it was (barely) closer than where my trailer is stored. This isn't a cheap hobby- I wish you the best in finding a safe, suitable tow rig.

BigDaveZJ
02-13-2008, 12:42 AM
Or just get AAA.

zj95maxx
02-13-2008, 07:51 AM
getting another car is iffy, I dont think I can swing insurance on both. Pat is getting a truck very soon and we are splitting the cost of the trailer and going to take turns every month trailering out shit wheeling, just one rig. So its fine, I was just seeing if it was possible to get BOTH rigs out there on a trailer, thanks for all you guys opinions though, this thread is over, thanks

J B
02-13-2008, 09:54 AM
getting another car is iffy, I dont think I can swing insurance on both.

Like I said, that's just a cost associated with the hobby.

BigDaveZJ
02-13-2008, 10:18 AM
Like I said, that's just a cost associated with the hobby.


Yup.

Once a vehicle gets to a point, you either gotta build it to be reliable enough to be a DD and be able to afford all of the maintenence costs of it being a DD and all the increased wear and tear associated with that, or pony up and get another vehicle.

The most I've ever paid for insurance on one vehicle was $210 a month, and that was when I was 16 and I had almost every coverage imaginable. I would think you can find a way to make it work. You may not be able to dump as much $$$ into the Jeep, but it will be better to have a DD and/or tow rig.

J B
02-13-2008, 10:43 AM
Like a lot of my firends who got out of college and, since they were actually making some money, went out and bought sports cars...not really thinking what the insurance would cost on an unmmarried male driver in his early 20s. Woops.

What do you know, here's a guy with a new Mustang GT or WRX, and he's still having to eat ramen noodles and can't afford to take a girl out in his hot car, because he didn't consider all of the costs involved in his purchase.

SirFuego
02-13-2008, 11:43 AM
Pat is getting a truck very soon and we are splitting the cost of the trailer and going to take turns every month trailering out shit wheeling, just one rig.

That's definitely better than nothing. I went on a trip to RC (6 hour drive for me) with only my buddy. He drove, I trailered mine. My buddy snapped a U-joint and ball joint trying to pull me out. So I drove my ZJ home, he towed his TJ back with my truck (I was the reason he broke, so I wasn't going to make him drive my ZJ back). Sure it's not ideal, but the odds of you breaking at the same time are pretty small. Only thing is that the weekend is probably over once one of you breaks beyond repair -- lucky for us, that happened on Sunday with only two or three hours of wheeling left anyways.

It definitely beats the alternative of putting yourself and others on the road in a really dangerous situation.

I'm sure there were others thinking something similar to what you were and hopefully reading this thread will immediately throw that idea out of their minds.

Dirtdiver
02-13-2008, 04:33 PM
Goose neck tralior, but the weight is what you'll have to find the laws in your state.

MoonWorks
02-14-2008, 01:53 PM
Goosenecks are great...but expensive. Plus the truck that's needed to pull it goes into another class as well.

If your buddy pat gets a truck and ya'll get the trailer...one pulls and the other drives. If the one that drives breaks...then it goes on the trailer on the way home. That should get ya'll through for a while.

But like I mentioned. Start looking for a truck now. Once you figure out what exactly you want and you actually find that within your "price"...it will be a while.

DarkXJ
03-24-2008, 03:24 PM
Oh yeah, and once you do get that truck, don't friggin lift it with some big tires on it. That's almost as retarded as towing with an unworthy vehicle. No wait, its every bit as retarded because a lifted truck with big high profile tires is an unworthy vehicle. Talk about high center of gravity/instability while towing...:eek:

canadian_driver
03-24-2008, 03:27 PM
Oh yeah, and once you do get that truck, don't friggin lift it with some big tires on it. That's almost as retarded as towing with an unworthy vehicle. No wait, its every bit as retarded because a lifted truck with big high profile tires is an unworthy vehicle. Talk about high center of gravity/instability while towing...:eek:


dont you ever have anything smart to say?

OverkillZJ
03-24-2008, 03:36 PM
He's not wrong...

canadian_driver
03-24-2008, 03:39 PM
never said he was, but i think anyone on this forum is more or less smart enough to relize that a lifted tow rig sucks. just seems every post they've made has been something stupid... but anyways disregard my previous post doesn't really matter

DarkXJ
03-24-2008, 03:54 PM
Just pointing out for the OP that if he thinks an Explorer being way overloaded isn't ideal, but is ok, he just might need to be told don't tow with a lift truck either.
Oh, and PS, nice contribution

FishPOET
03-25-2008, 02:56 PM
Oh yeah, and once you do get that truck, don't friggin lift it with some big tires on it. That's almost as retarded as towing with an unworthy vehicle. No wait, its every bit as retarded because a lifted truck with big high profile tires is an unworthy vehicle. Talk about high center of gravity/instability while towing...:eek:

The exception would be lifts to fit 19.5 or 22.5 wheels and tires. They would increase stability.

DarkXJ
03-28-2008, 01:06 PM
I'm not entirely sold on that idea, if you're fitting the bigger wheels in order to get lower profile tires for less sidewall flex, than those trucks have plenty of space to fit a bigger wheel with lower profile tires. Had a friend buy an 04 GMC 2500 Duramax, fit 22s under it stock with room to spare.

FishPOET
03-29-2008, 09:58 PM
I'm not entirely sold on that idea, if you're fitting the bigger wheels in order to get lower profile tires for less sidewall flex, than those trucks have plenty of space to fit a bigger wheel with lower profile tires. Had a friend buy an 04 GMC 2500 Duramax, fit 22s under it stock with room to spare.

I did not mention 22's or lower profile tires.

F, G & H rated tires provide optimum stability for towing heavy loads. 33's on 19.5 wheels are rated at 4080 to 4940. 35's on 19.5 wheels are rated at 5070 to 5510.

The 22.5 x 35 tires would be rated from 6040 to 7200

Do a little research on commercial tires and you might be sold on the idea.

CurtP
03-30-2008, 07:28 AM
Goosenecks are great...but expensive. Plus the truck that's needed to pull it goes into another class as well.
Oh bullshit.

http://i142.photobucket.com/albums/r96/4dszr1/image0022.jpg

http://i142.photobucket.com/albums/r96/4dszr1/image0013.jpg

http://images.corvetteforum.com/images/smilies/leaving.gif

:flipoff2:

Brad S
03-30-2008, 09:44 AM
wow...:smt087

DarkXJ
03-30-2008, 11:58 AM
I did not mention 22's or lower profile tires.

F, G & H rated tires provide optimum stability for towing heavy loads. 33's on 19.5 wheels are rated at 4080 to 4940. 35's on 19.5 wheels are rated at 5070 to 5510.

The 22.5 x 35 tires would be rated from 6040 to 7200

Do a little research on commercial tires and you might be sold on the idea.
Being honest and realistic here, who do you know who has actually bought real commercial tires (as in semi tires/wheels) to fit onto their full-size pickup to do some towing? I suppose I could take it further and agree with you that lifting the truck to fit 20" military wheels with 53" Michelin XMLs off one of the new 7 ton trucks would increase stability too because they have a really high load rating also... :rolleye:
My point remains, lifting a truck raises its center of gravity causing it to be more affected by winds, swaying of the trailer etc. With a higher load rating, you may be able to carry heavier loads without damaging the wheel/tire combo, but you'd still be subject to the laws of physics in regards to stability. Not to mention the obscene drop hitches most of these guys run. I'm always amazed that more of these drop hitches don't bend or warp under acceleration/braking/cornering/etc.

FishPOET
03-30-2008, 04:21 PM
Being honest and realistic here, who do you know who has actually bought real commercial tires (as in semi tires/wheels) to fit onto their full-size pickup to do some towing?

I personally know of hundreds of folks running 19.5 wheels and tires on full-size pickups. I know a few running 22.5 wheels and tires on full-size pickups.

http://www.ricksontruck.com/why_195s.html

Do some research on hotshotting. Most of them are running commercial tires on their full-size pickups

Ford is using 19.5 wheels on new F450s and F550s.


With a higher load rating, you may be able to carry heavier loads without damaging the wheel/tire combo, but you'd still be subject to the laws of physics in regards to stability.

The physics of stable towing are tires rated to carry the load, suspension rated to carry the load, TV wheelbase, overhang, horsepower, brakes, weight distribution, sway control, a properly loaded level trailer, TV speed, etc.

Tires are the weak link. Ask anyone who has tried towing a 6000# Jeep trailer with P rated tires about their unstable experience.

Cody
03-30-2008, 06:07 PM
I know people riding on 19.5's too. The ride isn't as good, but they are good for hauling heavy loads.

MoonWorks
03-30-2008, 11:05 PM
Oh bullshit.

http://i142.photobucket.com/albums/r96/4dszr1/image0022.jpg

http://i142.photobucket.com/albums/r96/4dszr1/image0013.jpg

http://images.corvetteforum.com/images/smilies/leaving.gif

:flipoff2:

WOW! That's worse than me towing my grand on a 4200 lb construction trailer behind a WJ! Thankfully I don't do that anymore.

Jeeperoni91
04-01-2008, 11:18 AM
If your buddy pat gets a truck and ya'll get the trailer...one pulls and the other drives. If the one that drives breaks...then it goes on the trailer on the way home. That should get ya'll through for a while.



thats what my buddy in a local jeep club does...tows his tj and if someone in the club breaks then they drive his tj back and he'll tow your shit back that broke on his trailer

CurtP
04-01-2008, 01:21 PM
I know people riding on 19.5's too. The ride isn't as good, but they are good for hauling heavy loads.

Semi truck rims and tires on pickups are EVERY-FUCKING-WHERE around here. I have not seen a single one of them actually doing a lick of work. Out of everyone I personally know (who are local) whom have a 3/4-ton or larger truck, only one of them actually tows on a regular basis, and he is only using the stock wheels on his F350.

I've been thinking about trying to convince my dad on using 19.5" truck rims and tires on his 2500HD. He pulls a 30k# wagon around with his truck in the fields and eats through tires.